PCEngineFans.com - The PC Engine and TurboGrafx-16 Community Forum
NEC PC-Engine/SuperGrafx => PC Engine/SuperGrafx Discussion => Topic started by: lukester on March 16, 2012, 12:22:44 PM
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People seem to diss the PC Engine's graphics compared to the SNES. I know they are generally not as good, but the PCE technology was 3 years older than the SNES's. Are there any HuCard games that you guys think look as good or better than at least some SNES games?
Here are some I think are fantastic: remember, HUCARDS ONLY
Air Zonk
Street Fighter II
1943 Kai
Samurai Ghost
Bomberman 94
New Adventure Island
Runner Up: Parodius(not as good as SNES version)
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Oh boy, the can of worms opens again.
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All of them.
/thread
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All of them.
/thread
A-f*cking-greed. Seriously, how are the SNES's graphics better? The Genny I could maybe see, but not the sness.
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People seem to diss the PC Engine's graphics compared to the SNES. I know they are generally not as good, but the PCE technology was 3 years older than the SNES's. Are there any HuCard games that you guys think look as good or better than at least some SNES games?
Here are some I think are fantastic: remember, HUCARDS ONLY
Air Zonk
Street Fighter II
1943 Kai
Samurai Ghost
Bomberman 94
New Adventure Island
Runner Up: Parodius(not as good as SNES version)
You know there are tons of SNES games that look bad or NES quality. :P I'm guessing that you're thinking of above average SNES games and even then, likely with a certain aesthetic style in mind. If you're counting Samurai Ghost and 1943, then you're setting the bar pretty low for PCE. Here are others you'd probably count:
Magical Chase
Aeroblasters
Ninja Spirit
Super Star Soldier
Soldier Blade
Tatsujin
Twinbee
Hana Taka Daka
Liquid Kids
Blue Blink
SFII'
Strip Fighter II
Download
Cloud Master
Coryoon
Neutopia
Neutopia II
Dungeon Explorer
Alien Crush
Devil's Crush
R-Type
Darius Plus
Sidearms
Altered Beast
Cyber Knight
Gekisha Boy
Raiden
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Every game on PCE that is a HuCard looks f*cking sweet, and anyone who disagrees can go put their wang in a wall outlet like this guy:
http://www.ebaumsworld.com/video/watch/80872560/
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Every game on PCE that is a HuCard looks f*cking sweet, and anyone who disagrees can go put their wang in a wall outlet like this guy:
http://www.ebaumsworld.com/video/watch/80872560/
Really Arkhan? The PC Engine ain't the best always. Look at Blodia or the New Zealand Story(such awful colors)
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Really Arkhan? The PC Engine ain't the best always. Look at Blodia or the New Zealand Story(such awful colors)
you're right I love playing those two games on my SFC.
Oh wait.
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PCE or gtfo.
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Every game on PCE that is a HuCard looks f*cking sweet, and anyone who disagrees can go put their wang in a wall outlet like this guy:
http://www.ebaumsworld.com/video/watch/80872560/
Really Arkhan? The PC Engine ain't the best always. Look at Blodia or the New Zealand Story(such awful colors)
What about Dragon Slayer, Dragon Quest V, Tecmo Secret of the Stars, Earthbound, Aretha, Paladin's Quest, Gdleen, Final Fantasy Mystic Quest, Live A Live, Romancing Saga, Ys IV, Lagoon, Drakkhen, Ryukihei Dan Danzarubu, Sansara Saga 2, Inindo, Romance Of The Three Kingdoms 2, Galaxy Wars, Arkanoid, Space Invaders, Ninja Gaiden Trilogy, Caravan Shooting Collection, Paper Boy 2, Q Bert 3, Rampart, Zoop, Gekitou Burning Pro Wrestling, Mega lo Mania, Hanafuda, Pro Kishi Simulation Kishi no Hanamichi, Liberty or Death, Sanrio World Smash Ball, Keiba Yosou Baken Renkin Jyutu, Sin Seiki GPX Cyber Formula, Konpeki no Kantai, Turbo Toons, Hunt for Red October, Kakinoki Shogi, Ballz 3D, Rise of the Robots, Sim Earth, Sim Ant, Sim City, Super Mario World, etc... for SNES/SFC?
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It could be argued that with a larger color palette from which to choose and with transparency and multiple backgrounds, not to mention more sprites to throw around, that, artistic concerns aside, the SNES was technically capable of better graphics. It also had more VRAM, which also helps a great deal. That said, I think the PCE was more than capable of keeping up enough to be in the same field. The PCE was not wholly inferior, and some of the Hucard games did show the available power off. Download and Magical Chase are two that come readily to mind. Psychosis is rather colorful, but I'm not sure colorful is adequate by itself, given that even the color-limited Sega Genesis managed to host a number of very colorful-looking games.
I'm not sure limiting the field to Hucards only is really fair, anyway. Because the SNES and Genesis lacked CD-ROM attachments, they used mappers to generate very large cart sizes, while the only large HuCards were Street Fighter II', which was graphically very close to the SNES version, and the Arcade Card. Since the SNES and Genesis had larger cart sizes they could put lots of graphical (and auditory) data on the cart and simply pull it when needed. The only reason you didn't see large cart sizes on the PCE was because it was simply far cheaper to release a CD than a mapper-equipped HuCard. If more large HuCards were released, some of them might have had better graphics than some of the CD releases. It has already been discussed in previous forum posts that SFII' might not even have been possible (at least not unadultered) with the Arcade Card, due to it needing so much readily available data, more by a little than the Arcade Card had on tap.
Let's face it. The CD-ROM attachment and the various system cards didn't add any graphics hardware to the system. They just provided additional storage space for data, meaning, with the SuperCD, you could dedicate a whole 8 mib at a time to a single level, or even more than that if you were willing to split the level with a load point. Some CD and SuperCD games aren't much larger, if they are larger at all, than some of the largest SNES and Genny cartridges. So, again, redbook audio aside, a HuCard only challenge is even MORE apples to oranges than simply comparing the platforms.
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Let's face it. The CD-ROM attachment and the various system cards didn't add any graphics hardware to the system. They just provided additional storage space for data, meaning, with the SuperCD, you could dedicate a whole 8 mib at a time to a single level, or even more than that if you were willing to split the level with a load point. Some CD and SuperCD games aren't much larger, if they are larger at all, than some of the largest SNES and Genny cartridges. So, again, redbook audio aside, a HuCard only challenge is even MORE apples to oranges than simply comparing the platforms.
Plus SNES carts use various amounts of compression, with at least a few adding hardware for it. The actual game size of the average PCE CD game (minus overtly superfluous content like massive cinemas) isn't much different than the actual game size of the average SNES game and I'm sure than many are smaller. Far East of Eden Zero is supposed to be 136 uncompressed megs for example. But the PCE CD2 and SCD formats were still as much of a bottle neck as they were a positive format for overall storage.
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Dragon Egg has awesome colors
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the only problem with the hueys was its limited space (except SFII' huey), and has absolutely nothing to do with the graphical limitation of the system. a huey can also produce sapphire grafx on screen, just not as many as on a (A)CD.
also most hueys are from a diffeent era, where games looked different. by the time the SFC started breathing, PCE was already moving towrad SCD technology.
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Considering the PCE came out first by years, the question is "Can the SNES compete with Hucard games?" The answer is always "No." The SNES is a piss poor piece of garbage that completely fails to live up to the NES.
PCE=PS3
SNES=Jaguar
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It also had more VRAM, which also helps a great deal.
No it didn't. It had the same 64KB of VRAM as its two direct competitors.
with the SuperCD, you could dedicate a whole 8 mib at a time to a single level, or even more than that if you were willing to split the level with a load point.
The System 3 RAM bank is 2 megabits, not 8.
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the NES.
PCE=PS3
SNES=Jaguar
Don't insult the PCE
Nintendo Bypassed the entire MSX scene, and built the famicom instead.
Think about it, the famicom is not so far off, and they made a decision to build a game system over a computer.
Hudson made the Bee-card series, for the MSX. Obviously Hudson did not have the funds that Nintendo had access to. Hudson Soft could have built a bee-card reader for the NES, but it would have been a slap in their faces, after giving Nintendo the idea to biuld a game system.
However Nintendo has years of TV-games to back their move. They never needed Hudson Soft to tell, them to make the Japanese Atari.
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SNES has about 5 games worth playing same as the Jag
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Come on, 5 games? I'm curious to hear what they are.
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My big gripe with the SFC is that almost all the games have aged very poorly compared to the other systems.
Even the "omg look" games like R2 use basically one background on loop for an entire stage at a time. Mario World,
DKC, all have like 4 different backgrounds and they loop again and again. Who cares if the game goes on for 3 hours if every stage looks the same.
If you can't use variety, then the stages shouldn't go over 2 mins. That damn raft ride on chomakaimura is the exact same thing on loop for over 3 and a half minutes, die and you do the whole thing again, the hardest part of cho is not falling asleep to it.
As a kid I loved Mario Kart, but playing it these days, the AI cheats so badly and it gets annoying very quickly. When the real challenge of the game is not running into Lugi's rapid-fire unlimited starmen, I turn off the game.
Megaman X is all kinds of awesome, until you realize there's only like 3 enemies on screen at once, all that speed but so much empty space...
Castlevania IV is so stupidly easy that I've actually fallen asleep while playing it...
R-Type III's first level is so long and boring I also have fallen asleep to it...
These days the only SFC games I actually play:
Contra Spirits
Super Metroid
Hagane
Jacky Crush
and lol that's all I can think of right now.
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Comparing the PCE with PS3 is obviously for fun, but I still have to say it. PCE < PS3 in realistic graphics. Taste is one thing, but let's not be childish. Well, okay let's be, but at least be smart about it. The childish...ness. I don't know anymore, I think I need to pee.
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Comparing the PCE with PS3 is obviously for fun, but I still have to say it. PCE < PS3 in realistic graphics.
I disagree. For some folks (who enjoy psychedelic substances), the PCE graphics are more realistic. The muted color on PS3 simply can't compare to PCE's bold, vivid splashes of delight. (http://junk.tg-16.com/images/pcg0.png)
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It also had more VRAM, which also helps a great deal.
No it didn't. It had the same 64KB of VRAM as its two direct competitors.
with the SuperCD, you could dedicate a whole 8 mib at a time to a single level, or even more than that if you were willing to split the level with a load point.
The System 3 RAM bank is 2 megabits, not 8.
You are right on both points. Don't know what I was thinking.
The former came up VERY recently in another thread. I was too lazy to look it up and now I'm paying the price.
The latter point, yeah, no excuse there, either. I wrote the post late at night and was tired. Was I spot on with all the non-numerical stuff?
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Let's face it. The CD-ROM attachment and the various system cards didn't add any graphics hardware to the system. They just provided additional storage space for data, meaning, with the SuperCD, you could dedicate a whole 8 mib at a time to a single level, or even more than that if you were willing to split the level with a load point. Some CD and SuperCD games aren't much larger, if they are larger at all, than some of the largest SNES and Genny cartridges. So, again, redbook audio aside, a HuCard only challenge is even MORE apples to oranges than simply comparing the platforms.
Plus SNES carts use various amounts of compression, with at least a few adding hardware for it. The actual game size of the average PCE CD game (minus overtly superfluous content like massive cinemas) isn't much different than the actual game size of the average SNES game and I'm sure than many are smaller. Far East of Eden Zero is supposed to be 136 uncompressed megs for example. But the PCE CD2 and SCD formats were still as much of a bottle neck as they were a positive format for overall storage.
You know, I just thought of something that's come up on this forum in the past. I forget who it was, though it might have been ccovell, but someone pointed out that Lords/Winds of Thunder, I believe, decompresses graphical data into VRAM in real time. It is stored in compressed form. I suspect other games use this trick as well. Someone correct me if I've misremembered.
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Here's how I judge the systems by games
PC Engine: ports of the most popular arcade games, legendary shooters, decent platformers
Megadrive: ports of the strangest arcade games(Toki, Two Crude Dudes, Chelnov), average shooters(even the Toaplan ports), boring platformers
SNES: most original games, few good shooters(Gradius III, but really hard), excellent platformers, ZELDA!!!!
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This is going to go on forever.
Even the "omg look" games like R2 use basically one background on loop for an entire stage at a time. Mario World,
I could diss Nintendo, but there has been many great games, for the system that is worth playing as well. Some that I am looking at.
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It's like poo and thjen it's not.
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The former came up VERY recently in another thread. I was too lazy to look it up and now I'm paying the price.
touku mentioned it, but as also mentioned there, the system is capable of addressing 128KB but only 64KB is installed. The PCE can likewise address 128KB, but only 64KB is installed. Interestingly enough, Magic Engine enables all addressable 128KB of VRAM, so you have twice the VRAM there as with a normal console... it'd be great for making a Magic Engine-only game though.
The latter point, yeah, no excuse there, either. I wrote the post late at night and was tired. Was I spot on with all the non-numerical stuff?
Pretty much.
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My big gripe with the SFC is that almost all the games have aged very poorly compared to the other systems.
Even the "omg look" games like R2 use basically one background on loop for an entire stage at a time. Mario World,
DKC, all have like 4 different backgrounds and they loop again and again. Who cares if the game goes on for 3 hours if every stage looks the same.
You must HATE Neo/Nectaris and many Turbo/PCE games then.
If you can't use variety, then the stages shouldn't go over 2 mins. That damn raft ride on chomakaimura is the exact same thing on loop for over 3 and a half minutes, die and you do the whole thing again, the hardest part of cho is not falling asleep to it.
What about RPGs?
Megaman X is all kinds of awesome, until you realize there's only like 3 enemies on screen at once, all that speed but so much empty space...
You don't need a screen full of enemies for good or fun gameplay. One of the biggest problems with 16-bit games is when they try to throw everything but the kitchen sink into each screen just for the sake of differentiating it from 8-bit games. Instead of just concentrating on what makes a game good.
Here's how I judge the systems by games
PC Engine: ports of the most popular arcade games, legendary shooters, decent platformers
Megadrive: ports of the strangest arcade games(Toki, Two Crude Dudes, Chelnov), average shooters(even the Toaplan ports), boring platformers
SNES: most original games, few good shooters(Gradius III, but really hard), excellent platformers, ZELDA!!!!
I guess you really haven't even seen videos of many PCE games, let alone played them. No one who is familiar with the PCE, even if they're a Genesis or SNES fanboy, doesn't agree that the PCE has the most original and best selection of the "strangest" games. It also sounds like you limit yourself to the kinds of games you play in general, since even when summarizing the legendary SNES, you don't even mention RPGs.
The PCE is actually the weakest of the three consoles for ports of the most popular arcade games, for non-Japanese players at least. The PCE is loaded with ports of great arcade games, but most non-Japanese players haven't even heard of half of them. The PCE also has very few straight-platformers. There is a lot of great platforming gameplay in PCE games, but they usually mix in other gameplay as well.
It sounds like you're just a SNES fan who is beginning to try Mega Drive and PC Engine stuff. There's nothing wrong with that, but you shouldn't try to judge the libraries before you've experienced much of them. You're also better off trying games in emulation before buying them instead of asking for opinions on whether they're worthwhile. You obviously have specific tastes. But if you give some of the hundreds of PCE and MD games which don't fall within the genres you traditionally play a chance, I'm sure you'll find many games you'll love and open up a massive range of games to consider for all consoles, even SNES.
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People seem to diss the PC Engine's graphics compared to the SNES. I know they are generally not as good, but the PCE technology was 3 years older than the SNES's. Are there any HuCard games that you guys think look as good or better than at least some SNES games?
Here are some I think are fantastic: remember, HUCARDS ONLY
Air Zonk
Street Fighter II
1943 Kai
Samurai Ghost
Bomberman 94
New Adventure Island
Runner Up: Parodius(not as good as SNES version)
1943? 1943 looks like shit.
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This thread is retarded.
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A quick scroll through this thread http://www.pcenginefx.com/forums/index.php?topic=6609.1080 is always a good reminder how small the SNES sprites are and how washed out the colors are compared to teh pce. :)
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The PCE also has very few straight-platformers.
Out of sheer curiosity, what do you consider a straight platformer? Since platforming has sort of become my niche, I'd love to help fill in the gaps. :D
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People seem to diss the PC Engine's graphics compared to the SNES. I know they are generally not as good, but the PCE technology was 3 years older than the SNES's. Are there any HuCard games that you guys think look as good or better than at least some SNES games?
Here are some I think are fantastic: remember, HUCARDS ONLY
Air Zonk
Street Fighter II
1943 Kai
Samurai Ghost
Bomberman 94
New Adventure Island
Runner Up: Parodius(not as good as SNES version)
Aero Blasters, Raiden, Neutopia 2, Tatsujin, Soldier Blade to name a few. I assume you mean 1941 and not 1943. Because else, I can list a shit others that are better looking that 1943.
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My big gripe with the SFC is that almost all the games have aged very poorly compared to the other systems.
Even the "omg look" games like R2 use basically one background on loop for an entire stage at a time. Mario World,
DKC, all have like 4 different backgrounds and they loop again and again. Who cares if the game goes on for 3 hours if every stage looks the same.
You must HATE Neo/Nectaris and many Turbo/PCE games then.
If you can't use variety, then the stages shouldn't go over 2 mins. That damn raft ride on chomakaimura is the exact same thing on loop for over 3 and a half minutes, die and you do the whole thing again, the hardest part of cho is not falling asleep to it.
What about RPGs?
Megaman X is all kinds of awesome, until you realize there's only like 3 enemies on screen at once, all that speed but so much empty space...
You don't need a screen full of enemies for good or fun gameplay. One of the biggest problems with 16-bit games is when they try to throw everything but the kitchen sink into each screen just for the sake of differentiating it from 8-bit games. Instead of just concentrating on what makes a game good.
Here's how I judge the systems by games
PC Engine: ports of the most popular arcade games, legendary shooters, decent platformers
Megadrive: ports of the strangest arcade games(Toki, Two Crude Dudes, Chelnov), average shooters(even the Toaplan ports), boring platformers
SNES: most original games, few good shooters(Gradius III, but really hard), excellent platformers, ZELDA!!!!
I guess you really haven't even seen videos of many PCE games, let alone played them. No one who is familiar with the PCE, even if they're a Genesis or SNES fanboy, doesn't agree that the PCE has the most original and best selection of the "strangest" games. It also sounds like you limit yourself to the kinds of games you play in general, since even when summarizing the legendary SNES, you don't even mention RPGs.
The PCE is actually the weakest of the three consoles for ports of the most popular arcade games, for non-Japanese players at least. The PCE is loaded with ports of great arcade games, but most non-Japanese players haven't even heard of half of them. The PCE also has very few straight-platformers. There is a lot of great platforming gameplay in PCE games, but they usually mix in other gameplay as well.
It sounds like you're just a SNES fan who is beginning to try Mega Drive and PC Engine stuff. There's nothing wrong with that, but you shouldn't try to judge the libraries before you've experienced much of them. You're also better off trying games in emulation before buying them instead of asking for opinions on whether they're worthwhile. You obviously have specific tastes. But if you give some of the hundreds of PCE and MD games which don't fall within the genres you traditionally play a chance, I'm sure you'll find many games you'll love and open up a massive range of games to consider for all consoles, even SNES.
Look Black Tiger and everyone. I'm not a SNES fanboy. The PCE is my favorite system. I just want to hear your opinions on games. This thread may seem retarded, but I feel that these forums have had a lot of inactivity lately. Oh, and I really don't like RPGs.
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A quick scroll through this thread http://www.pcenginefx.com/forums/index.php?topic=6609.1080 is always a good reminder how small the SNES sprites are and how washed out the colors are compared to teh pce. :)
Some awesome games in here I've never seen before. I'm very excited to the discovery of some new PCE/TG games that awaits me!!
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Sure a lot of Hucards repeat the same backgrounds like the SNES does, but the levels are usually much shorter. So it feels like I'm actually getting somewhere. I much prefer an abundance of shorter levels then a few stupidly long levels. And I like having everything thrown at me all the time. If I have time to stand there doing nothing, then it's wasted time. I guess I see games like I see life in general, if I have time to sit on my ass doing nothing at home or at the office, it's just a waste, must be busy all the time.
I like RPGs, but once again I like the fast-paced more busy ones. Tales of Destiny 2 (jp PS2) with it's insanely cheap auto-counter AI, gives me such an adrenaline rush. Growlanser on PS1, SRPG that really does throw everything at you all at once. For RTS games, my favorite is "Z", where you must be constantly doing something or you get owned, no silly resource collecting garbage.
I'm an arcade gamer at heart, it's all about speed, insanity, and the feeling that gameover can come at any second, f*ck YEAH
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SD, I think you'll like a game I've got cooking in the dark alleys of PCEland then...
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A quick scroll through this thread http://www.pcenginefx.com/forums/index.php?topic=6609.1080 is always a good reminder how small the SNES sprites are and how washed out the colors are compared to teh pce. :)
a legendary page in a legenday thread in the history of videogame related forums :D
btw. still makes me big rolfmaololing when ever i look at that:
(http://i567.photobucket.com/albums/ss114/bethcongo/CD_50C2BF2F-035.png) vs. (http://i567.photobucket.com/albums/ss114/bethcongo/ForgottenWorldsWREV00_019.gif)
:lol: :lol: :lol:
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BWAHAHAHAHAHA
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Look Black Tiger and everyone. I'm not a SNES fanboy. The PCE is my favorite system. I just want to hear your opinions on games. This thread may seem retarded, but I feel that these forums have had a lot of inactivity lately. Oh, and I really don't like RPGs.
I'm curious why you settled for 'as good as SNES games'. Is it because the Mega Drive's graphics are too good, so you met the HuCards half way by comparing them to only SNES graphics?
Anyway, here are some examples-
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp1a.png)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp1.png)
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp2.png)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp2a.png)
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp3.png)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp3a.png)
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp4a.png)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp4a.png)
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp5.png)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp5a.png)
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp6.png)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp6a.png)
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp7.png)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp7a.png)
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp8.png)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp8a.png)
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp9.gif)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp9a.png)
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp10.gif)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp10a.png)
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp11.png)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp11a.png)
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp12.png)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp12a.png)
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp13.png)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp13a.png)
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp14.png)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp14a.png)
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp15.gif)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp15a.png)
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp17a.png)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp17.png)
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp18b.png)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp18a.png)
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp19.png)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp19a.png)
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp20.gif)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp20a.png)
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp21.gif)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp21a.png)
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp22.gif)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp22a.png)
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp23.gif)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp23a.png)
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp24.gif)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp24a.png)
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp25.gif)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp25a.png)
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp26.gif)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp26a.png)
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp27.gif)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp27a.png)
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp28.png)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp28a.png)
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp29.png)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp29a.png)
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp30.gif)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp30a.png)
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp31.gif)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp31a.png)
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp32.png)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp32a.png)
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp33.png)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp33a.png)
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp34.gif)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp34a.png)
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp35.gif)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp35a.png)
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp36.gif)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp36a.png)
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp37.png)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp37a.png)
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp39.png)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp39a.png)
(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp40.gif)(http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/scomp40a.gif)
No repeated games. All SNES carts and all PCE HuCards.
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/threadwin
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Arcana is a pretty sweet game though. Better than Lady Sword.
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Those images are kinda unfair. To be realistic, Nintendo gave the option to the maker to use their own rom-chips. The PCE just decided to go into CD-roms. You can see the limitation of the systems storage capacity without that extra boost. You can also see that by using an adapter over the SNES. Like an NES or Floppy disk adapter ( that can cause some games saves to not work ).
One thing Nintendo did commit to, was putting up the fight to stay with carts instead of CD's.
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Those images are kinda unfair. To be realistic, Nintendo gave the option to the maker to use their own rom-chips. The PCE just decided to go into CD-roms. You can see the limitation of the systems storage capacity without that extra boost. You can also see that by using an adapter over the SNES. Like an NES or Floppy disk adapter ( that can cause some games saves to not work ).
I'm not seeing any CD games up there. All HuCards, baby!
One thing Nintendo did commit to, was putting up the fight to stay with carts instead of CD's.
Which turned out to be the biggest mistake they ever made.
But yeah, this comparison isn't that fair, as the SNES came out three years later than the PC Engine, but the fact that the PCE can look that much better graphically shows what a lackluster piece of hardware the SFC is. Sure it's got a much bigger color palette and better sound capabilities, but even then I still prefer the bright, crisp colors of the PCE and it's awesome chiptunes much better.
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But yeah, this comparison isn't that fair, as the SNES came out three years later than the PC Engine.
and measured even a fraction of the SFC's size. hardware as well software wise.
but still, it isn't fair, since the PCE used awesome miniaturized state of the art technology, whilst the MD and SFC used 2nd hand parts from the dumpster or borrowed them form early 80s alarm clocks.
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Not to mention the build quality. The Core Grafx consoles in particular are just solid little machines. And I've bought PCE's that have obviously been left outdoors for a number of years that work like a charm after scraping the dirt off them. The SFC is a pretty solid system but it just doesn't compare to the tangible quality of the CoreGrafx. And then you have abominations like the Mega Drive Model 2 which just exude cheapness in every way.
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This thread is retarded.
I love the PC Engine but the Super Famicom/SNES is simply the greatest games console of all time, anyone who disagrees lives in a world of fail.
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This thread is retarded.
I love the PC Engine but the Super Famicom/SNES is simply the greatest games console of all time, anyone who disagrees lives in a world of fail.
So we all, except you, live in that world of fail. I still think this is the better world then.
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This thread is retarded.
I love the PC Engine but the Super Famicom/SNES is simply the greatest games console of all time, anyone who disagrees lives in a world of fail.
It's cool to have favorites, but saying that anyone who doesn't worship what you do is wrong is the only true fail.
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im pretty sure he's trollin foar teh lulz.
plus, anyone that doesn't worship PCE is a retarded window licker.
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I think that a side-by-side comparison of PCE and SNES graphics is a lot like the Pepsi Challenge. Nearly everyone who took that test said that Pepsi tasted better, yet the general population continued to buy vastly more Coke. Some still argue about why, but most agree that the only reason that the Pepsi Challenge always came out in Pepsi's favor was because of how much more overwhelming the sweetness of Pepsi is when taken side-by-side with Coke. It simply stands out more. Over the long-run, however, Coke is the more satisfying choice for most people.
That's how I feel about a lot of PCE graphics. The colors are more vivid, and there tends to be a lot of contrast in the palette, so they stand out really well taken side-by-side. However, the best of the SNES games have their own kind of balance and richness which is appealing in a way that people are not always really conscious of.
Don't get me wrong, a lot of those comparisons are clear wins for the PCE, and I love the look of games on this system. I just also love the look of SNES games, too, and I feel that they get a little too much flak for being "washed out".
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that has something.
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I took the pepsi challenge and knew which was which.
I sipped the first one (pepsi) and said "this pepsi is nasty give me the coke!" and they were like O_O
f*ck pepsi.
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Well in the States at least the SNES did so well at least partially because of the success of the NES. I mean, up until fairly recently people still said "playing Nintendo" when they meant playing video games. I'm sure many old folks still do. So the SNES was a guaranteed success either way, especially when so many of their franchises were household names, and they dominated the third party market though less than savory business practices in the 8-bit era. It's amazing SEGA could break through as well as they did at the time with the Genesis.
I grew up playing the Sega Master System and I think I knew one other kid who had one. The Genesis was a no-brainer for me, and I just enjoyed the types of games which were released for SEGA systems, and still do. I had seen and read about the TG-16 as a kid but getting a new piece of hardware was a pretty rare event for me, so I went with what I knew, and I think that's what a lot of people did with the SNES. Plus a lot of great games from third parties such as Konami, Capcom, Squaresoft, Hudson, etc., came out for the system along with some first party gems. So to me I think the success of the SNES has very little to do with the hardware but with the marketing, demographic appeal, and a decent library of games well-supported by third parties. Nintendo has been successful at grabbing the casual and mainstream market with the DS and Wii as well, and it works for them, but for me I don't really see the company are the pinnacle of gaming as so many people actually do. But I think I'm preaching to the choir here! Sorry for the wall-o'-text!
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I love the PC Engine but the Super Famicom/SNES is simply the greatest games console of all time, anyone who disagrees lives in a world of fail.
My opinion is fact, and if you disagree that opinions make great facts, my opinion is that you suck (that's a fact, yo!).
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I like 'em both :)
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I like 'em both :)
I like them both too, but I struggle sometimes to find as many good games on the SNES as the PCE. If you ask 10 people the best SNES games, there's probably gonna be the 7 same games on every list.*
Ask people their top 10 PC Engine games, and there's probably more variety
*ok, that probably is bullshit, but I'm just saying, a lot of people are gonna choose things like Mario Kart, Mario World, DK country, Secret of Mana, and Final Fantasy or something. But I think there's a lot of bad to average games for the SNES, and they're all so damned expensive.
That said, when the SNES does good, it does REALLY good.
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I've found that it's usually casual players who have generic top lists, because they don't really explore catalogs and never try games that don't fall within popular genres unless they're told they're hip to be aware of. The language barrier is a deal breaker for these types, but it never even gets that far for it to be an issue.
Too often when people dismiss the PCE, they say they know everything there is to know about it because they've tried or seen Lords of Thunder and Dracula X. Mention a game they've never heatd of and they'll point out that it can't be any good if they've never heard about it, just like the Turbo/PCE in general.
The SNES gets unfairly trashed too often the same way as well, usually by Genesis fans. One popular argument is that only the 10% of RPGs which were released in English count and if they can't get into a game or it's from a genre they don't play, then it sux.
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I like all systems equally
except I like the PCE more.
lol
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Okay the SNES, and Genesis programming wise could not out do a PCE.
The SNES and Genesis are both using boards cassettes, while the PCE is using boards......credit card sized things. Of course the SNES would have the storage capabilities, that out weighs a PCE card.
Vampire Kiss on the SNES compared to the PCE is a completly differnt, and smaller PCE game. I was reading their was an actual computer port of the SNES game???
Y's4 is another example of the above. They downsized a brilliant game to make it so that is appears like two differnt versions, The same with Mega Bomberman on the Genesis, PCE, and SNES.
A better example is Shin Mega Tensi series. The SNES got the whole shebang, but the PCE and the Mega Drive only got the first game. Why? Because they probably tallied up the sales total, and decided it was best to sell on the SNES.
The same could be said for the fallout of the Saturn generation. You
could be apart of the "now" generation or what was best. It was obvious that the gaming communities wanted to keep the Saturn as prime. However the PSX 3d programming was already being programmed from 1991 ( from a company who speciality was televisions, computers, and sound systems that is a simple death wish ).
All of the entire SNES games could run and play well, on the PCE. Why didn't they do it? Because they were worried about sales, and profits. From my understanding in Japan. They make more games then they need to produce, and that is why we have so many new games out their in the wild?
Hudson, Sega, and NEC all were once greats but in reality like the Amiga,
Apple, and Atari they are really the underdogs. Everybody knows their potentials, and why they should be considered best but to keep up with
coperate, and consumer standards is like fighting a wall of fire.
We all know the PCE was and is better, then the SNES, and Genesis combined. We even know the PCE was better then the all the SEGA modifications to the original Genesis. The PCE could take on the Saturn
with the right equipment, but Hudson I believe was far from doing battle along with NEC being the upper hand over EA games suggestion.
Then the N64 had westerners approval for the usage of the Silicon Graphic workstations ( which made it easier for 3d development for the west ).
Everybody simply wants that crutch or crotch to stand on. So they do not have to gamble at their chances of sales. It is like how everybody wear the latest fashion trends to feel they belong, or that they are smart, or how vendors all buy expensive celluar phones, and flat screen televisions to look as if the store is doing well.
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Everybody simply wants that crutch or crotch to stand on.
Word.
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I've found that it's usually casual players who have generic top lists, because they don't really explore catalogs and never try games that don't fall within popular genres unless they're told they're hip to be aware of. The language barrier is a deal breaker for these types, but it never even gets that far for it to be an issue.
Too often when people dismiss the PCE, they say they know everything there is to know about it because they've tried or seen Lords of Thunder and Dracula X. Mention a game they've never heatd of and they'll point out that it can't be any good if they've never heard about it, just like the Turbo/PCE in general.
The SNES gets unfairly trashed too often the same way as well, usually by Genesis fans. One popular argument is that only the 10% of RPGs which were released in English count and if they can't get into a game or it's from a genre they don't play, then it sux.
Well said. (http://junk.tg-16.com/images/pcgs.png).
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Something that seems to have been overlooked in this discussion are possible reasons why games ported between the PCE - SNES - Mega Drive may be better or worse other than hardware strengths and weaknesses. For instance, some ports are done by different companies and we all know that some companies are known for good ports and others put out absolute shit. Outrun on the PCE was excellent and was ported by NEC Avenue, whereas the Mega Drive port was done by Hertz and wasn't as good. Ys III was ported by Hudson on the PCE while Tonkin House did the SNES port. Not all developers are equal. All one has to do is look at Golden Axe, developed by Telenet, to see that some developers just do not know how to exploit the power of the platform they're making games for. We all know the PCE could do better than that. I defy you to tell me that Strider on the PCE looks better than the MD port. The colors are terrible, the lightning effects on stage 2 are terrible as well, along with many other things, plus it was on the Arcade Card. Why? Because NEC Avenue made a shit port with the exception of the soundtrack.
It's been touched on already but the storage medium used plays a huge part as well. Ghouls N Ghosts looked great at the time it came out for the MD but pales in comparison to the SGX port. Besides the SGX being more powerful, it was 8mb versus 5mb for the MD. With those extra 3mb of space they were able to put more background tiles in, more animation, etc. Given the extra memory the MD port could've been almost as good. All the missing roots in the hillside on stage 1 would be there, the level 1 boss animation would be there, etc. Forgotten Worlds is another example. The PCE port is a Super CD and allows for so many more background tiles, animations, etc. The MD port was 4mb I believe, while the the PCE could use 2mb per level. Admittedly that Sphinx boss looks like ass but it could've been better.
Lastly, I'm a huge PCE fan, been collecting for over 10 years, owned nearly every piece of PCE hardware, owned tons of games, etc, but gotta say that all the SNES hate is kinda crazy. Too many great games on that console to bash it.
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I don't understand the SNES hate either though I understand (but not really agree with) the arguments. I love the SNES! And the PCE! And the MD! And the NES! And the Neo Geo! And the N64! ...and I can go on, and on, and on, and....
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To build on what Ryu and Mathius have already said: I don't understand the SNES hate! Very silly.
(http://junk.tg-16.com/images/cooks_transb.gif) Cook wants the hate to take a permanent vacation.
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Agreed.
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Definitely. Over at Sega 16 I see ridiculous threads bashing the SNES or the PC Engine, which I don't get involved in, and I feel kind of pleased that we don't have that crap in the PCE community. I like to think of it as a reflection that we know what we're talking about.
But I have and play all 3, have games I love on all of them, and despite their flaws I wouldn't change any of them.
I just like the PC Engine more ;)
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Over at Sega 16 I see ridiculous threads bashing the SNES
OK, this is one thing.
or the PC Engine
but this is just ridiculous :lol:
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Definitely. Over at Sega 16 I see ridiculous threads bashing the SNES or the PC Engine...
Not only on Sega 16, unfortunately. To me, this phenomenon seems mostly relegated to the SMS and MD/Genesis fans. There is a tremendous amount of hate from these guys towards other systems (especially SNES), but not the same amount in the other direction.
I think it might have a lot to do with Sega's marketing in the US. Sega made it cool to hate the SNES, and I think a lot of Genesis fans seem to still be brainwashed from the TV commercials.
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Well, as a kid, I didn't like a lot of MD games. I saw it as a bit of a 3rd rate system compared to my Amiga, but it's the same with anything, the quality of the titles you're exposed to means a hell of a lot, and Gynoug, Quack Shot, Streets of Rage and Sonic couldn't balance out Wrestle War, Last Battle, Ecco, Desert Strike* and all the countless football games. Years later, I got to choose my own games (rather than play for half an hour at friends houses) and I got to like the system for what it was.
The opposite happened with my friend. He was so drawn in by the legend, Yu Suzuki, Space Harrier, Outrun, and Thunderforce, that he's nearly exclusively Sega. He went Megadrive, Saturn, Dreamcast... and pretty much stopped there. He plays some stuff that's not current gen and I think he owns a GBA, but that's how much the Sega bug bit him.
*these games are not necessarily bad, but they're either too deep to get into in a short time, or too shallow to want to pay more than £2 for
My Megadrive is currently unplugged.
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Man, does anyone else remember being littler and not giving two f*cks what system was what?
I used to play Sega and Turbob at the same time.
lol.
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Man, does anyone else remember being littler and not giving two f*cks what system was what?
I used to play Sega and Turbob at the same time.
lol.
Yes but marketers did a good job of creating these messages that pushed the hatorade that we see now. Ultimately what we learn is that the power of advertising IS STRONG like the dark side.
Now on to collect those retro machines that made you happy and discover a whole bunch of new ones.
Oh and as far as graphics, IMO, it's a matter of art direction, and knowing what to do with what a systems gives you.
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Man, does anyone else remember being littler and not giving two f*cks what system was what?
I used to play Sega and Turbob at the same time.
lol.
Nope. I was pretty poor when I was a kid, and I could only really afford one system, and every birthday or xmas, getting a few games for that system.
Mine was my Amiga. I used my Dad's, and I got my first A500 after I sold my Speccy and my C64 to fund it and never looked back.
I used to get the occasional magazine after the SNES and Megadrive came out, and I had friends with those systems. But there was no way I could afford a second system until much later, and reviews and screenshots played an important part of the decision making process!
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At least the Amiga looked sweet, and had some of the same games.
Some of them really blow on Amiga though because of the stupid 1 button design.
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Definitely. Over at Sega 16 I see ridiculous threads bashing the SNES or the PC Engine...
Not only on Sega 16, unfortunately. To me, this phenomenon seems mostly relegated to the SMS and MD/Genesis fans. There is a tremendous amount of hate from these guys towards other systems (especially SNES), but not the same amount in the other direction.
I think it might have a lot to do with Sega's marketing in the US. Sega made it cool to hate the SNES, and I think a lot of Genesis fans seem to still be brainwashed from the TV commercials.
Although I do see the more passionately hate from Sega fans, it's more of an underdog thing. Similar Nintendo fans dismiss rival consoles and games without really caring because they believe that it is a given that Nintendo is perfection and everything else pales in comparison. They'll even justify ignorance by saying there's no point actually learning about other games because there's no way they can be as good and they're only interested in the best of the best. While many SNES hating Genesis fans seem to study famous SNES games just to find things to find things to ctiticize.
Too many Sega and Nintendo fanboys miss out on the PCE altogether because they suffer from the Nintendo elitist syndrome combined with game mag propaganda and honestly believe that the PCE really is just an 8-bit caliber consile with pretty colors and they don't have to try the games to know that they're not worthwhile.
In the end you wind up with a bunch of people arguing about who knows best over something where each side is unfamiliar with the other.
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At least the Amiga looked sweet, and had some of the same games.
Some of them really blow on Amiga though because of the stupid 1 button design.
Damn right. Up to jump, WTF.
I can't believe how few people put in options to use a MD pad, or even a CD32 pad, when they were about £10 a pop.
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yeah thats the worst part .
the Amiga can do more buttons but it don't help when the games don't support it.
Shadow of the Beast looks awesome but plays like ass on the Amiga.
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http://www.commodoreusa.net/CUSA_AMIGAmini.aspx
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listen, don't post that MacMini knock off wannabe amiga revival bullshit!
:) lol
there is no boing ball, or rainbow checkmark.
Revivalfail.
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Too many Sega and Nintendo fanboys miss out on the PCE altogether because they suffer from the Nintendo elitist syndrome combined with game mag propaganda and honestly believe that the PCE really is just an 8-bit caliber consile with pretty colors and they don't have to try the games to know that they're not worthwhile.
That's kinda sad, but it's also..
btw. still makes me big rolfmaololing when ever i look at this:
(http://i567.photobucket.com/albums/ss114/bethcongo/CD_50C2BF2F-035.png) vs. (http://i567.photobucket.com/albums/ss114/bethcongo/ForgottenWorldsWREV00_019.gif)
:lol: :lol: :lol:
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listen, don't post that MacMini knock off wannabe amiga revival bullshit!
:) lol
there is no boing ball, or rainbow checkmark.
Revivalfail.
lmao - thought you'd get a kick out of it. Talk about relying on brand name.
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yeah I've been laughing at those stupid C64 and Amiga recreations for awhlie now. The C64 ones were worse. they stick it in a breadbin but its just a f*ckin netbook basically. lies and filth.
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http://www.commodoreusa.net/CUSA_AMIGAmini.aspx
What the hell is this?
Amiga, Inc. actually makes new, modern Amigas (boing ball and all) but this looks like some pirate knock-off by a grey-market manufacturer. I'm not even sure how they're getting away with it, considering Amiga, Inc. owns the Amiga brand.
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http://www.commodoreusa.net/CUSA_AMIGAmini.aspx
What the hell is this?
Amiga, Inc. actually makes new, modern Amigas (boing ball and all) but this looks like some pirate knock-off by a grey-market manufacturer. I'm not even sure how they're getting away with it, considering Amiga, Inc. owns the Amiga brand.
Err... Not quite... "Amiga Inc" is more or less a patent/licensing house. At first they were geared towards an "AmigaAnywhere" run-everywhere OS which didn't quite go anywhere.
In the mordern "Amiga's":
There is an "AmigaOne" series of PPC-based computers that run Amiga OS4 developed (at least principally by Hyperion). The computers themselves: AmigaOne XE/SE and Micro A1 by Eyetech (discontinued), SAM line of computers by Acube and the AmigaOne X1000 by A-EON.
Amiga OS4 can also run on a Pegasos II (more on that later. :P)
Alternatively, AmigaForever is a version of UAE packaged with other utilities made by Cloanto that have officially licensed Amiga roms.
Commodore USA bought the commodore licence and I think bought licensing to use the Amiga name for another line of PC based computers running its own OS?
Of course there is also MorphOS which is another "Amiga compatible" OS. It's not compatible with OS4 (although there is an library you can install that will give you partial compatibility with OS4) but it will work with software developed for OS3.1 and earlier provided it doesn't do any hardware banging. :P MorphOS runs on Pegasos Line of computers (Peg 1, and 2 are both discontinued), Efika PPC (discontinued) and the team is now concentrating on making the OS compatible with PPC-based macs (PowerMac G4's are more or less all compatible, even partial compatibility with the PPC Cube).
Last but not least, there's AROS and its variants. AROS started out as an open-sourced reimplementation of AmigaOS 3.1 (other variants are aiming to add more modern features even if it breaks source-compatiblity). AROS is typically aimed at x86-based systems but could be compiled for 68k and ran on original Amiga Hardware instead of AmigaOS. The good thing is that 68K AROS (and a compiled AROS "ROM") could subtitute AmigaOS in an UAE installation and be used legally.
Of course, to be honest the order of this would be: AROS and MorphOS started their development, then Amiga OS4 followed by Commodore USA's OS. :P
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maaan. I really loved the Amiga, and I kept up hope for many years that it would somehow survive or come back. I think a lot of other people did.
But now they need stop f*cking around with it's dull lifeless corpse. It's pissing me off, and it never goes anywhere, it's just tarnishing the once-great name.
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Commodore/Amiga is basically a hilarious joke now.
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Commodore/Amiga is basically a hilarious joke now.
Soap Opera would be more accurate. :P
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I tried to read td741's response, but I'm so thrilled I was able to coax multiple paragraphs out of him, I'll have to wait until I've settled down.
This is the same guy who was voted "PCEFX's Most Creepiest Member" back in 2007's "PCEFX's Most Creepiest Member" contest. He was the runaway winner with more time spent online than *any other member* since the 2006 forum software switch, and less than 100 posts (at the time) to his name.
Amazingly, he's no longer even in the top 10 users who've spent the most time online here. nectarsis has taken the crown as the current PCEFX creeper with almost DOUBLE the amount of online time as the #2 (Necromancer). While his high post count might lead you to believe he's not really a creeper, the fact that he virtually never posts anymore dictates he might as well have less than 100 posts to his name.
</derail>
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I tried to read td741's response, but I'm so thrilled I was able to coax multiple paragraphs out of him, I'll have to wait until I've settled down.
This is the same guy who was voted "PCEFX's Most Creepiest Member" back in 2007's "PCEFX's Most Creepiest Member" contest. He was the runaway winner with more time spent online than *any other member* since the 2006 forum software switch, and less than 100 posts (at the time) to his name.
Amazingly, he's no longer even in the top 10 users who've spent the most time online here. nectarsis has taken the crown as the current PCEFX creeper with almost DOUBLE the amount of online time as the #2 (Necromancer). While his high post count might lead you to believe he's not really a creeper, the fact that he virtually never posts anymore dictates he might as well have less than 100 posts to his name.
</derail>
Hahahahahhahaa. Even before I read your post, I said to myself, "Holy Jesus, td is serious! He is providing an incredibly detailed response...I don't think he has ever written this much in his last 25 posts!"
(http://junk.tg-16.com/images/cooks_transb.gif) Cook loves the AmigaOS.
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I tried to read td741's response, but I'm so thrilled I was able to coax multiple paragraphs out of him, I'll have to wait until I've settled down.
This is the same guy who was voted "PCEFX's Most Creepiest Member" back in 2007's "PCEFX's Most Creepiest Member" contest. He was the runaway winner with more time spent online than *any other member* since the 2006 forum software switch, and less than 100 posts (at the time) to his name.
Amazingly, he's no longer even in the top 10 users who've spent the most time online here. nectarsis has taken the crown as the current PCEFX creeper with almost DOUBLE the amount of online time as the #2 (Necromancer). While his high post count might lead you to believe he's not really a creeper, the fact that he virtually never posts anymore dictates he might as well have less than 100 posts to his name.
</derail>
I can't blieve I'm not up there. My home PC is always on, and I usually have a tab open for here
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You've only had an account here for 1 year. The person at the top of the list has logged more online time on the forum than your account has even existed. Give it another year or so. If you're on as much as you claim, you'll make the list.