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Non-NEC Console Related Discussion => Chit-Chat => Topic started by: BigusSchmuck on June 26, 2012, 12:29:12 PM
Title: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: BigusSchmuck on June 26, 2012, 12:29:12 PM
The company that I work for is going through a software conversion and I come to find out today its hosted on IBM servers. Now the good news seeing how I work for a COOP it will combine a lot of the things we are doing into one software package which makes my life much easier in that sense and its hosted off site. Bad news is, the interface is all command line driven, so we are going backwards to the days before DOS whereas the bits and pieces of software we currently use are Windows based. Even sadder yet, this wasn't IT's decision to do this, we had no input it was all accounting and grain, two of the most computer illiterate groups at work ever. So what do you guys think about IBM Mainframe software? So far I think its a waste of time and will cause more headaches than its worth considering that a lot of organizations are going off this stuff.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: SignOfZeta on June 26, 2012, 01:26:09 PM
I don't think you actually mean an actual IBM "mainframe". That shit is extinct, isn't it? Even if they were in use they wouldn't be even close to fast enough to serve shit at today's speeds.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: SuperDeadite on June 26, 2012, 01:38:58 PM
command line inputs are awesome. So much quicker to get stuff done exactly as you want it. It's not IBM's fault most people are lazy and ignorant of how to truly use a computer these days. GUIs have ruined people.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: NightWolve on June 26, 2012, 01:40:42 PM
Even sadder yet, this wasn't IT's decision to do this, we had no input it was all accounting and grain, two of the most computer illiterate groups at work ever.
Dunno about IBM Mainframe software (Just quick reaction, but who and how many around here even would be familiar with it? The odds of finding someone to chat about that seem very low if you ask me, but you've been here longer, so I dunno.), but I had a similar experience at my last job where the IT dept. is the last to be consulted about relevant matters. Product managers setting deadlines for product developers in the IT dept. without any prior input from them. It always drove me nuts... They would set a deadline without getting any input from those that would actually be doing the development of the product and yet were the least computer literate, then when the deadline is missed, they would wonder how come...
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: kazekirifx on June 26, 2012, 01:58:48 PM
Are you sure the command line interface is DOS, not some type of UNIX? I don't think DOS is used for servers - other than a hacked version I found from just googling now.
Really what you're describing doesn't sound like such a bad decision at all. My company uses Windows servers, and while the interface is very easy to use for those who are not comfortable with a command line environment, UNIX variants are typically much more stable, and also very easy to use once you are familiar with the commands.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: Tatsujin on June 26, 2012, 02:28:49 PM
I don't think you actually mean an actual IBM "mainframe". That shit is extinct, isn't it? Even if they were in use they wouldn't be even close to fast enough to serve shit at today's speeds.
Thats pretty much what it is on steroids. http://www-03.ibm.com/systems/i/index.html
Are you sure the command line interface is DOS, not some type of UNIX? I don't think DOS is used for servers - other than a hacked version I found from just googling now.
Really what you're describing doesn't sound like such a bad decision at all. My company uses Windows servers, and while the interface is very easy to use for those who are not comfortable with a command line environment, UNIX variants are typically much more stable, and also very easy to use once you are familiar with the commands.
It predates DOS hence the reason why I was making fun of it. Its not so much the software itself that bothers me, but rather the timing. Harvest is a big time thing over here and by far the busiest time of the year. If these buerocrats had any kind of common sense, they would have had us doing this in the fall time where things aren't so busy and that way we can have some time to actually test it out and train people. As it stands right now we go live with this thing on July 1st and only had a month to train people. I dunno if you guys have done any big time software conversions, but anything of this magnitude should at least be tested for the first month, train people the next month and then go live the third month. Again, we are talking 250+ employees (not counting temp workers which easily makes it over 300) 90% of them are completely computer illiterate and only 3 of us to try to train these guys. It also should be noted that the systems that we are converting are from the grain departments, accounting, petroleum, agronomy and payroll. Ugh what a mouthful. :P
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: SignOfZeta on June 26, 2012, 03:05:20 PM
command line inputs are awesome. So much quicker to get stuff done exactly as you want it. It's not IBM's fault most people are lazy and ignorant of how to truly use a computer these days. GUIs have ruined people.
Please, this is such bullshit. I mean, you are joking, right? You must be joking. If you had to admin a company with 100 million directories you'd just like...memorize where all that shit is then, wow. You must be a goddamn genius. I bet your entire home network is all monochome dumb terminals 'cause its legit. File names more than 8 characters long are for retards, right?
Seriously, no matter what it is, if nobody knows how to use it then it isn't the right decision. Anyone who can't understand that concept needs to take the sliderule out of their ass. It's obviously in so deep it's causing brain damage.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: FiftyQuid on June 26, 2012, 03:33:51 PM
command line inputs are awesome. So much quicker to get stuff done exactly as you want it. It's not IBM's fault most people are lazy and ignorant of how to truly use a computer these days. GUIs have ruined people.
I 100% agree. Give me a CLI like TL1 anyday.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: Opethian on June 26, 2012, 03:47:45 PM
If you are afraid of CLI then you dont script and a monkey could do your job. Mainframe isnt dead. IBM is trying hard to stay relevent in the "cloud" computing space so its no wonder they pitched a hosting service at your people and sounds like they won. I think IBM is overpriced for what you get. There are many other companies doing the same thing. Unless they are moving you software to a company they acquired you probably paid too much.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: SignOfZeta on June 26, 2012, 04:34:57 PM
Command line interfaces in 2012 are basically a Tic Tac measuring contest where everyone loses. f*ck that shit. I have work to do.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: NightWolve on June 26, 2012, 05:03:03 PM
In the CLI v. GUI issue, I do find myself needing CLI at times, but definitely prefer a GUI. CLI is necessary at times and in certain work environments a must; it depends on the situation, but calling a CLI 'awesome' is a bit of a stretch for me. I don't disagree with the rest of what SuperDeadite said, though. Computer users that started off with a CLI and then moved on to GUI tend to be more literate/competent. But eh, that's the point of a GUI, to make it as easy as possible for anyone in general to use a computer (not having to be a super techhead to use one), even the dumbest among us. Bringing up calculators is kind of a good comparison, we're better off overall with 'em, even though less of us can do basic math in our heads having been spoiled by 'em.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: soop on June 26, 2012, 11:36:05 PM
If you really have just bought an entire bunch of shit running AS400, then I'm sorry for you. I understand a lot of the financial sector still use it, but it's hyper-outdated.
As for the GUI vs command line debate, a GUI can still do command line, and thus is obviously superior. You get a simplified intuitive interface for everyday tasks, and you get a command line interface for all the other stuff.
I usually have a dozen putty sessions up to all kinds of boxes, Solaris, linux, Cisco IOS or whatever, but I can't draw a pretty picture on any of 'em.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: SuperDeadite on June 27, 2012, 01:03:13 AM
GUI is fine for most things. I run Windows XP on my lappy. But there are still some stuff that is just easier to run via the command prompt. The ability to just add a simple "/X" to the end of a line is just cleaner, faster, and easier then trying to do that in any GUI I've ever used.
Today especially GUIs have gone insane. Shit like Windows 8, the Metro crap they want to put on my 360, big flashy buttons are a step backwards. It's like the damn GameCube controller with the big giant red button. Just push here and forget about having any real control over your computer.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: soop on June 27, 2012, 01:17:29 AM
GUI is fine for most things. I run Windows XP on my lappy. But there are still some stuff that is just easier to run via the command prompt. The ability to just add a simple "/X" to the end of a line is just cleaner, faster, and easier then trying to do that in any GUI I've ever used.
Today especially GUIs have gone insane. Shit like Windows 8, the Metro crap they want to put on my 360, big flashy buttons are a step backwards. It's like the damn GameCube controller with the big giant red button. Just push here and forget about having any real control over your computer.
I'd never use Metro on a PC unless it was purely a media center - and even my PC isn't *just* a media center. But I've been using it on my phone for nearly a year now, and it's great. I've been using touchscreen Windows phones since 2004, and they kind of went backwards for a while, which ended up in me installing all kinds of software on non-standard architecture and hacking the registry and overclocking stuff... I'm much happier with Metro.
And as for stuff like text manipulation, I agree; it's usually much more flexible to use awk sed or even vi in a unix shell than it is to do something in Windows.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: Tatsujin on June 27, 2012, 01:17:50 AM
PUSH THE BUTTON, MAX!
(http://dcdrecords.com/blog_images/Hannibal8.jpg)
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: majors on June 27, 2012, 01:38:37 AM
this wasn't IT's decision to do this, we had no input it was all accounting and grain, two of the most computer illiterate groups at work ever.
Welcome to the next level.
I got nothing on mainframes, we run all Window servers and couple of Linux boxes (for DNS only). My job is helpdesk, I do not touch servers (thats other ppls jobs). End users are a mix of Windows and OSX...I apply most of my hate on the Mac users.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: DragonmasterDan on June 27, 2012, 02:17:18 AM
Dunno about IBM Mainframe software (Just quick reaction, but who and how many around here even would be familiar with it? The odds of finding someone to chat about that seem very low if you ask me, but you've been here longer, so I dunno.), but I had a similar experience at my last job where the IT dept. is the last to be consulted about relevant matters. Product managers setting deadlines for product developers in the IT dept. without any prior input from them. It always drove me nuts... They would set a deadline without getting any input from those that would actually be doing the development of the product and yet were the least computer literate, then when the deadline is missed, they would wonder how come...
I deal with IBM mainframe every day. Fortunately it's mostly things like simple password resets, VPS printer stops and restarts, very simple stuff. But because it works it's still in use.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: Arkhan on June 27, 2012, 03:24:30 AM
GUI is fine for most things. I run Windows XP on my lappy. But there are still some stuff that is just easier to run via the command prompt. The ability to just add a simple "/X" to the end of a line is just cleaner, faster, and easier then trying to do that in any GUI I've ever used.
Today especially GUIs have gone insane. Shit like Windows 8, the Metro crap they want to put on my 360, big flashy buttons are a step backwards. It's like the damn GameCube controller with the big giant red button. Just push here and forget about having any real control over your computer.
For starts, Metro is also designed for the touchy poke interface Mobile WORLD! Good luck CLIing on a tablet or a phone. I know I don't want to type in a bunch of jive from the command line on a retarded touch keyboard with no tactile feedback.
anyway, GUIs are simply a front end for CLIs. So the whole argument is kind of stupid. You can't quickly highlight an entire list and delete stuff with a CLI, but you also can't type del *.jpg with a GUI. BFD. The end result is the same. You deleted a buncha JPGs.
GUIs were created so that MORE people could get into computers. They're meant to be intuitive so you can just turn the computer on and get shit done, even if you're new to it. They were pioneered by a bunch of dorks that are legit as f*ck. Punch Card Legit. If they had the same mindset as you, we'd all be fingering our a$$holes while feeding punch cards into machines because it's how you truly used a computer at the time.
They pioneered the GUI concept so the mass majority could actually enjoy their computers, and computers as a whole could evolve into something cooler.
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command line inputs are awesome. So much quicker to get stuff done exactly as you want it. It's not IBM's fault most people are lazy and ignorant of how to truly use a computer these days. GUIs have ruined people.
It's not always quicker. Depends what you're doing.
and, yeah, it is partially IBMs fault. Ever hear of OS/2 ? Duh?
I do CLI shit everyday in Linux/Windows both at home and at work. So, I am not ignorant about how these things work. I use the crap when I have to.
I'm glad there are GUIs for a lot of system-related tasks. I don't want to sit and fingerbang in VI or Emacs and dickoff with a bunch of commands just to do things and then accidentally make a mistake and f*ck up something I was working on. It can and will happen to everyone.
GUIs didn't ruin anyone. The people you speak of likely wouldn't be bothering with computers without a GUI. They'd be too overwhelmed.
unless you're browsing the internet on Lynx, you should probably get off the CLI high horse. I doubt you are doing anything at home in the CLI that would impress anyone except 13 year old script kiddies on IRC.
EDIT: Oh yeah, the real topic:
The stuff you're going to deal with is kind of archaic/clunky, but, it works.
And heck, since it's so old, I bet any problem you have will be googleable! :)
You'll be fine. It'll get the job done.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: SuperDeadite on June 27, 2012, 04:24:14 AM
high-horse? lol. As stated i use XP for my actual daily computer. People these days are incredibly lazy and want their computer to do everything for them. Just another example of how are species is getting dumber every day. We humans are f*cked cause all we want to do is sit on our ass and fap. A person's refusal to actually read 20 pages of DOS for Dummies is just an extension of that. GUI have their uses, but it's gone overboard. When I reinstall XP and go to control panel I have to click that stupid line before it even appears. What I love about the command line is that it actually does exactly what i want unless I f*ck it up, the way it should be.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: Arkhan on June 27, 2012, 04:59:32 AM
high-horse? lol. As stated i use XP for my actual daily computer. People these days are incredibly lazy and want their computer to do everything for them.
Uh, What do you think computers were designed for? So people wouldn't have to sit and calculate stuff manually. duhrrr.
and yes, high horse. That's what you sound like you're riding around on when you say shit like "hooohooo, people are ignorant about how to truly use compootas!".
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Just another example of how OUR (you spelled it wrong, loloolool) species is getting dumber every day. We humans are f*cked cause all we want to do is sit on our ass and fap. A person's refusal to actually read 20 pages of DOS for Dummies is just an extension of that. GUI have their uses, but it's gone overboard.
You'd be surprised what people manage to pull off with GUIs. Saying that the world is getting dumber every day because of GUIs is incredibly short sighted.
GUIs do exactly what you want, and to say that they have gone overboard is a stretch. How have they gone overboard, exactly?
Ever install linux from the command line? It's a pain in the dick. I've gone as far as doing it with shit like Lunar Linux where you have to build everything as you go. I'd never do that again. Give me a Zenwalk disc, a few clicks, and a Linux desktop, ready to get shit done.
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When I reinstall XP and go to control panel I have to click that stupid line before it even appears.
You have to do what, click the control panel icon? So what?
hit the windows key, type in control panel, and hit enter. Voila. There's your control panel. It's just like the CLI! You type in crap, and things happen!
Windows 7 has done a good job of molding the two things together well. Windows XP does it clunkily, and Vista does it shittily.
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What I love about the command line is that it actually does exactly what i want unless I f*ck it up, the way it should be.
Does your mouse cursor have a temper? Does it sometimes go the other way, or right click instead of left click or something?
Unless you answered yes, the GUI also does exactly what you want. It isn't like the CLI can do EVERYTHING. It's limited by commands and their options just like a GUI is limited by your clicking and dragging.
you make it sound like the CLI is as great as TRON or something:
"OPEN FILE. I HAVE ACCESS CODE. OK THANK YOU. NOW, OPEN MY GAME PLEASE. THANK YOU COMPUTER!"
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: SignOfZeta on June 27, 2012, 06:36:52 AM
I just realized how hard I've been BASHin SUDOintellectual types.
I don't regret it. Or the shitty jokes.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: Arkhan on June 27, 2012, 06:42:58 AM
I just realized how hard I've been BASHin SUDOintellectual types.
I don't regret it. Or the shitty jokes.
They're so KORNy.
Are you sure you don't reGREP it?
that one was AWKward.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: RegalSin on June 27, 2012, 01:06:16 PM
1. IBM main business is building super computers for the United States goverment.
2. IBM is only a big comeback because of Intel, turning OSX into Windows.
3. Command Line OSes are better. The last good GUI OS, was Amiga. Everything else was Unix, or Windows variant.
4. I am not lying when I say this, if command line was still around and GUI was only videogames, I swear the closest thing to a GUI I would touch would be a game system.
5. IBM have security issues, accessing tasks, and files should not be a problem for ( whatever your job position is ). Most people in IT, are only smart as the IT in "Brazil" the film. I mean seriously, half of these guys do not even know how to request access to a computer. I imagine being there with my book of passwords and commands.
What is the difficulty of not using GUI? Multitasking? Honestly I do think it is a problem, if that is what you are getting at.
6. OS/2 was not a bad thing. People prefering Windows to play games, over OS/2 was a bad thing. OS/2 position for the last ten years of it's invention ( since StarTreck the next generations, Data ) is the usage in banking machines ( easy money ). I wonder what operating systems are ATM machines using nowadays.
7. IBM has it's place with it's goverment super computers. That is what IBM is now and forever. So unless your one of those guys who hangs out in a room full guys and one gal, that is not my problem
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: roflmao on June 27, 2012, 02:00:03 PM
I bet your entire home network is all monochome dumb terminals 'cause its legit.
That would be awesome...
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: SignOfZeta on June 27, 2012, 03:00:06 PM
I want to see the command line version of a redeye removal tool, iPod syncing/sorting, non-linear video editing...
Did development of the Internet peak with Lynx? Are games more lavish than Zork just eye candy for idiots? Seriously, you guys are pathetic. More than that, you are completely unrealistic. The vast majority of stuff that is done on computers these days is basically impossible with a command line interface.
I just watched Brazil the other night, btw. I recently got the five disc Criterion LD, finally. It's magical.
Btw, here is a video I made of me at the track on Sunday. Can you do this with a command like interface? I mean, in a single lifetime?
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: SuperDeadite on June 27, 2012, 03:17:27 PM
iPod syncing? LOL who uses that trash?
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: BigusSchmuck on June 27, 2012, 03:21:35 PM
1. IBM main business is building super computers for the United States goverment.
2. IBM is only a big comeback because of Intel, turning OSX into Windows.
3. Command Line OSes are better. The last good GUI OS, was Amiga. Everything else was Unix, or Windows variant.
4. I am not lying when I say this, if command line was still around and GUI was only videogames, I swear the closest thing to a GUI I would touch would be a game system.
5. IBM have security issues, accessing tasks, and files should not be a problem for ( whatever your job position is ). Most people in IT, are only smart as the IT in "Brazil" the film. I mean seriously, half of these guys do not even know how to request access to a computer. I imagine being there with my book of passwords and commands.
What is the difficulty of not using GUI? Multitasking? Honestly I do think it is a problem, if that is what you are getting at.
6. OS/2 was not a bad thing. People prefering Windows to play games, over OS/2 was a bad thing. OS/2 position for the last ten years of it's invention ( since StarTreck the next generations, Data ) is the usage in banking machines ( easy money ). I wonder what operating systems are ATM machines using nowadays.
7. IBM has it's place with it's goverment super computers. That is what IBM is now and forever. So unless your one of those guys who hangs out in a room full guys and one gal, that is not my problem
I personally don't have an issue with command line based OS. However, the end users over where I work at are mostly hicks, farmers, laborers, etc up until a few years ago didn't even know how to e-mail let alone remember their password (can't wait until that happens, three strikes and you can't get into the system and its time to call the boys at IBM to unlock them joy) to this "advanced" system we are going to. Yet, these are the type of people making these declensions on what direction IT should go. Hell, I even got a call today that someone said their printer was busted and all it was that it needed more paper. This is what I"m up against folks and we go live with this system on Monday.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: SignOfZeta on June 27, 2012, 03:45:24 PM
I generally only use CLIs for programming non Microsoft .NETish stuff, because IDEs are kind of annoying. PCE is done w/ notepad++ and CMD.exe.
but, for most other things, it's a pain.
Setting up wifi in linux? Yeah, give me the goony GUI some dork wrote to do it for me. I never remember the f*ckin commands. The little button never forgets the command though!
Even if I were a system admin, I'd likely use GUIs for a lot of shit. I'd probably write a bunch of scripts to do routine tasks for me. but, if there are GUI options, I am likely to fire that shit up first.
Even on Linux, I prefer updating/picking addons via the GUIs. Sitting and typing f*ckin apt/yum install commands all day is for retards. Check off all the boxes you like and press the go go go button.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: SignOfZeta on June 27, 2012, 04:47:32 PM
Seriously, I have 100GB of music. Tens of thousands of files. Sure, I'm too stupid to CD and MV all that shit, but even if I could...I'd be even stupider to actually do it that way because it would take f*ckING FOREVER and I'd gain nothing for the effort.
"What? You painted your house? Whatever, sheep, I did mine the old fashioned way, I glued macaroni over every inch of it. Yeah, I'll have to do it again after it rains a few times, but at least I'm not lazy."
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: Tatsujin on June 27, 2012, 05:16:43 PM
"What? You painted your house? Whatever, sheep, I did mine the old fashioned way, I glued macaroni over every inch of it. Yeah, I'll have to do it again after it rains a few times, but at least I'm not lazy."
HAHAHA!!
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: kazekirifx on June 27, 2012, 06:39:59 PM
I want to see the command line version of a redeye removal tool, iPod syncing/sorting, non-linear video editing...
Did development of the Internet peak with Lynx? Are games more lavish than Zork just eye candy for idiots? Seriously, you guys are pathetic. More than that, you are completely unrealistic. The vast majority of stuff that is done on computers these days is basically impossible with a command line interface.
I just watched Brazil the other night, btw. I recently got the five disc Criterion LD, finally. It's magical.
I love how you are dissing CLI's and talking about laserdiscs in the same post. :mrgreen:
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: NightWolve on June 27, 2012, 07:54:12 PM
What's a debate without knowing what RegalSin thinks, ya know? ;)
The last good GUI OS, was Amiga. Everything else was Unix, or Windows variant.
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I am not lying when I say this, if command line was still around and GUI was only videogames, I swear the closest thing to a GUI I would touch would be a game system.
GUI > CLI but a CLI is still necessary/useful as Arkhan pointed out well enough and better than I felt like doing. The GUI provides you with a CLI when you occasionally need it, so what's the discussion ? You seriously would prefer that the OS, in principle/by default, be controlled/interacted with mainly via a textual interface ?? Or what, you like taking the counter-intuitive position on a no-brainer and baiting folks ? ;) I don't regret my DOS-only days, but I'd never wanna go back to 'em...
I'm gonna have to approve of SignOfZeta's methods 100% here. This is like more of the excessive "retro-ness" vibe that I get around here (PCEFX). Sometimes I'm impressed by it, but this is not one of those times... Heh.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: RegalSin on June 27, 2012, 10:16:26 PM
I am trying to say that less is more. If windows was as clean, as Amiga and was in it's 2000 stage, I am sure that people would be like "oh windows is so cool" but they are not thinking about running a system, with no slowdowns, and lighting fast speed. They are thinking about downloading their film, while editing, while breaking the rules of workstation, and even traffficing the entire flow of the download, while ruinning their anti-virus software, and replying to this thread.
Take linux, packages. They are small, and runs lighting fast. To make it run faster, it could just be Unix. start program ( package ) and bamn bman bamn bamn, exit program. Then to make things odder, you lose the mouse feel.
A GUI OS, just make a person with ADD into a computer expert. Good for artists but not good for IT. However thank gosh for stickies, wonderfull stickies. List all your commands, around your monitor.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: soop on June 27, 2012, 11:11:35 PM
I am trying to say that less is more. If windows was as clean, as Amiga and was in it's 2000 stage, I am sure that people would be like "oh windows is so cool" but they are not thinking about running a system, with no slowdowns, and lighting fast speed. They are thinking about downloading their film, while editing, while breaking the rules of workstation, and even traffficing the entire flow of the download, while ruinning their anti-virus software, and replying to this thread.
Take linux, packages. They are small, and runs lighting fast. To make it run faster, it could just be Unix. start program ( package ) and bamn bman bamn bamn, exit program. Then to make things odder, you lose the mouse feel.
A GUI OS, just make a person with ADD into a computer expert. Good for artists but not good for IT. However thank gosh for stickies, wonderfull stickies. List all your commands, around your monitor.
I know I shouldn't be surprised, but that makes no sense.
There is so much shit that GUI is much better than a CLI for, and you can still have a CLI interface.
Unless the argument is that computers should be exclusive to "computer experts" (which I'm beginning to think it might be), I don't see why we're still arguing.
I'm on a Cisco router right now changing an IP address, and sure, I don't need a GUI for it because I do that crap day-in day-out. But if it's something I do once in a blue moon, like run a trace, or a packet capture, hellz yeah gimme a GUI, I can't remember that shit, but I can fill in a box, check some options and click "go". It's not like I'm an idiot that can't be bothered to learn, it's just my head is full of other stuff that I need more.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: Arkhan on June 28, 2012, 02:55:05 AM
I programmed Cisco routers for 2 years in highschool. It was fun.
It was also f*cking boring. We stopped working so we could play Unreal Tournament and Diablo 2.
Some of that router stuff turns out to be easier with a CLI when you telnet into the router and start pounding on it.
but most of it, just use some kinda f*ckin GUI. It's going to execute the same crap you could type but probably don't remember.
what'd be really funny is if the network is down and you have to program it to fix it and don't remember the commands.
CAN'T GOOGLE IT. lol.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: SuperDeadite on June 28, 2012, 03:02:26 AM
GUI > CLI but a CLI is still necessary/useful as Arkhan pointed out well enough and better than I felt like doing. The GUI provides you with a CLI when you occasionally need it, so what's the discussion ? You seriously would prefer that the OS, in principle/by default, be controlled/interacted with mainly via a textual interface ?? Or what, you like taking the counter-intuitive position on a no-brainer and baiting folks ? ;) I don't regret my DOS-only days, but I'd never wanna go back to 'em...
I'm gonna whole-heartedly disagree here on your generic GUI > CLI. GUI is better for casual computer users, and for casual computer interactions, but keyboard-driven input will always be faster for expert users, be it well-designed shortcuts or a CLI. That's the thing, though, CLI is not for novices. It requires memorization and familiarity, but once you have it you are inherently faster than any GUI user at a wide variety of tasks.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: Arkhan on June 28, 2012, 03:10:53 AM
GUI > CLI but a CLI is still necessary/useful as Arkhan pointed out well enough and better than I felt like doing. The GUI provides you with a CLI when you occasionally need it, so what's the discussion ? You seriously would prefer that the OS, in principle/by default, be controlled/interacted with mainly via a textual interface ?? Or what, you like taking the counter-intuitive position on a no-brainer and baiting folks ? ;) I don't regret my DOS-only days, but I'd never wanna go back to 'em...
I'm gonna whole-heartedly disagree here on your generic GUI > CLI. GUI is better for casual computer users, and for casual computer interactions, but keyboard-driven input will always be faster for expert users, be it well-designed shortcuts or a CLI. That's the thing, though, CLI is not for novices. It requires memorization and familiarity, but once you have it you are inherently faster than any GUI user at a wide variety of tasks.
It's a widely held adage that a *nix system admin will spend 2 hours making a script that simplifies a 5 minute task even if he only uses it once. I don't doubt that it can be faster, but if it requires memorisation and familiarity, is it worth it for things you seldom do?
Here's a story which is actually counter-supportive to my argument, but I was told early on; don't rely on fancy programs, and don't create a bunch of scripts to make your life easy. Some of the best advice I ever had. Because Unix is so old, most systems share a lot of basic commands and structures, so if you learn those basics, you'll be able to work on nearly any *nix OS.
Anyway, this guy I worked with was a proper Linux nerd, while our main OS was FreeBSD. He decided his workstation (which like every workstation was actually some kind of server for something else too, mine was the webserver, it was a small company) could do with an update, so he started messing about with shared libraries, installing his favorite bullshit programs he used at home.
Long story short, he messed around with some serious shit, and ended up dicking the machine to the extent that fstab got wiped, or it couldn't find it or whatever, which is pretty serious when you have a server like that. Guy came up to me white as a sheet and asked me for help, because he didn't have access to any commands less than 20 years old.
Took me about 10 minutes, but using my fstab as a reference, I managed to cat the whole fstab back from the command line and boot his machine back up, and no-one was any the wiser.
I use that story a lot in job interviews.
But STILL, if I have a GUI, I can have multiple putty sessions. This alone renders any argument against GUI null. I can copy and paste config easily from one box to another way faster than editing an existing file, scping it, closing down that session, opening another and blah blah blah however many times before I get it right.
It's like bowl vs ice cream when the ice cream comes with a f*cking bowl
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: Arkhan on June 28, 2012, 03:58:37 AM
ICECREAM BOWLLLLL
yeah.
I had to help some dipshit in highschool who was all scriptkiddielolol.
He wiped out all his config files for his screen while trying to do something stupid with his video card.
HALP I CANTPLAY GUIDLDWARS AND WOW IN WINE, HOW I FIX.
then he f*cked it all up trying to dual-boot, so I had to sit and do it again. It's a pain in the balls.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: Sparky on June 28, 2012, 04:15:54 AM
I think it's to do with iSync or whatever. I don't own any Apple products. Unless Quicktime counts?
Yeah. I don't know. That seems like a dumb thing to latch onto.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: SuperDeadite on June 28, 2012, 06:11:34 AM
Spucks is totally jealous of me, otherwise he wouldn't even have posted in this thread. It was by my sheer man charisma that brought him here. I don't think he even knows what this topic is about.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: Arkhan on June 28, 2012, 06:18:08 AM
Jealous of what. Your self inflicted xenophobia?
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: SignOfZeta on June 28, 2012, 06:24:17 AM
So much jealousy here. It's ok, just keep pretending your ifail doesn't sound like ass.
My main audio setup is vintage Marantz, Pioneer, Grado, etc. Its where good sounding shit belongs: in my living room.
Meanwhile, when I'm on the go I use an iPhone. The audio quality could be better, but its not supposed to be the ultimate in sound, its the ultimate in convenience. No device that small and that crammed with tech is going to sound great, but it does other things. That video I linked to before of me at the race track was done entirely on an iPhone, for example. The logging of GPS, G, speed, the video overlays, the countdown, all automatic. I guess that makes me a lazy fag, but whatever. The alternative is no video.
And besides...you have some other command like driven alternative that allows you to manage 100,000 files with keystrokes? I didn't think so.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: Arkhan on June 28, 2012, 06:26:21 AM
But if it's something I do once in a blue moon, like run a trace, or a packet capture, hellz yeah gimme a GUI, I can't remember that shit, but I can fill in a box, check some options and click "go". It's not like I'm an idiot that can't be bothered to learn
You remember when computers was a mans, world. Where most women would not thread at all. If it was a GUI, most women would never ever touch a keyboard, unless it was to type a letter, or send a message. However nowadays, everybody has that power.
I am not argueing, I am just saying that GUI's got carried away, over the years. First they made homer simpson, ( a person would never even get near a ramstick ) into an Harvard graduate, now Better Crocker, holds a mouse instead of a spatula. What has this world come to.
Then when we had games, it divided the userspace into two groups. The Videogamers, ( the pong freaks ) and the computer gamers ( the freaks who played pong after inputing commands. Yes the pong on the computerized systems was much more colorful and had better sound, but at least the computer user had the knowledge to use such games. No girls, allowed....No girls, allowed.... does that phrase not mean anything anymore. I am for equal rights but everybody is a computer wiz thanks to GUI, and while the workflo is easier then waking up and using the bathroom. Everybody who shuns computers just keeps on hating, but they can somehow find thier way to youtube, and facebook.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: NightWolve on June 28, 2012, 10:18:39 AM
You remember when computers was a mans, world. Where most women would not thread at all. If it was a GUI, most women would never ever touch a keyboard, unless it was to type a letter, or send a message. However nowadays, everybody has that power.
...
No girls, allowed....No girls, allowed.... does that phrase not mean anything anymore.
This is a man's world This is a man's world But it wouldn't be nothing Nothing, without a woman or a girl
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: kazekirifx on June 28, 2012, 01:50:50 PM
It's actually a woman's world. They just keep telling us it's a man's to keep men in check. :-$
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: SuperDeadite on June 28, 2012, 02:30:33 PM
wooooah... this your FAIL Princess D i am just here for the lolz....
Exactly you are here for me. You follow me everywhere. You should really stop this, I'm not gay. My cock is not for you. By the way you never answered my old question. Do you still use that SGX AC Adapter you got from me for free? Did you lick all my jizz resin off of it?
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: Sparky on June 28, 2012, 03:15:45 PM
But your such a catch, those long girly nails that thinning hair your a ladyboy in the making. Oh an I got that AC from Beamer, had I know it was yours ya I would have not touched it, poor beams.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: soop on June 28, 2012, 10:32:36 PM
I use Regal's randomness as subject lines in emails. I'm gonna use the better crocker one next.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: BigusSchmuck on June 30, 2012, 06:28:49 PM
Back on subject, I had to go through today and figure out what printers were emulated in this crappy software. Turns out that our expensive color copier, a few cheap printers aren't compatible. Too bad these IBM idiots didn't tell us that we had to emulate these printers until the last minute. Ugh. Good thing we can convert spooled files into HTML files or PDF. http://www.prodatacomputer.com/splf.shtml
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: kazekirifx on July 01, 2012, 01:58:11 PM
Ah. It really is an old AS400-based system. You're right. Why the hell would anyone adopt this now? My company just spent untold amounts of money and time switching over to something more up-to-date.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: Opethian on July 01, 2012, 02:52:27 PM
at my old job we migrated the application from AS400 machines to server 2008. the mainenance on the AS400s we had added up to over 1million dollars a year so yea it was worth it to move. the machines were older than me.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: roflmao on July 01, 2012, 03:21:40 PM
A couple of years ago I had to develop a website that interfaced with a database stored on an AS400 (order tracking and whatnot). That was one headache after another.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: BlueBMW on July 01, 2012, 05:03:45 PM
wooooah... this your FAIL Princess D i am just here for the lolz....
Exactly you are here for me. You follow me everywhere. You should really stop this, I'm not gay. My cock is not for you. By the way you never answered my old question. Do you still use that SGX AC Adapter you got from me for free? Did you lick all my jizz resin off of it?
But your such a catch, those long girly nails that thinning hair your a ladyboy in the making. Oh an I got that AC from Beamer, had I know it was yours ya I would have not touched it, poor beams.
So what do you do if you have two friends that want to kill each other? Its rough being the Universally Loveable Teddy Bear... :D
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: BigusSchmuck on July 02, 2012, 12:59:29 PM
Ah. It really is an old AS400-based system. You're right. Why the hell would anyone adopt this now? My company just spent untold amounts of money and time switching over to something more up-to-date.
The idea is to have one system to run almost everything cause we are a COOP. Man today was very irritating, spent 7 hours running around trying to get these printers to work only to find out about 15% aren't compatible with this damn software and one of them is a big ole expensive color copier that my company spent close to 10 grand on. Horrible, absolutely horrible.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: kazekirifx on July 02, 2012, 03:21:03 PM
The idea is to have one system to run almost everything cause we are a COOP. Man today was very irritating, spent 7 hours running around trying to get these printers to work only to find out about 15% aren't compatible with this damn software and one of them is a big ole expensive color copier that my company spent close to 10 grand on. Horrible, absolutely horrible.
Our AS400 caused all sorts of ridiculous printer issues as well. It's all antiquated and designed to work with ancient dot matrix printers. Needs conversion and emulation to work with modern printers at all. Changing over to our current system was also hell, and decisions were riddled with compromise. Still, now that we've had the current system for over a year and everything's settled down, I have to say my job is much much easier now than it was when we were using that antiquated AS400 system. Can't imagine why anyone would adopt it now. There must be plenty of other affordable modern options to choose from instead.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: BigusSchmuck on July 02, 2012, 03:41:54 PM
The idea is to have one system to run almost everything cause we are a COOP. Man today was very irritating, spent 7 hours running around trying to get these printers to work only to find out about 15% aren't compatible with this damn software and one of them is a big ole expensive color copier that my company spent close to 10 grand on. Horrible, absolutely horrible.
Our AS400 caused all sorts of ridiculous printer issues as well. It's all antiquated and designed to work with ancient dot matrix printers. Needs conversion and emulation to work with modern printers at all. Changing over to our current system was also hell, and decisions were riddled with compromise. Still, now that we've had the current system for over a year and everything's settled down, I have to say my job is much much easier now than it was when we were using that antiquated AS400 system. Can't imagine why anyone would adopt it now. There must be plenty of other affordable modern options to choose from instead.
Well if it was IT's descsion we would have found something that fit the bill, but all we got was a crappy 30+ year old system. Hell this thing belongs in a museum, and the fact that its older than me makes me wonder what the hell were they thinking?
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: kazekirifx on July 02, 2012, 07:21:28 PM
Well if it was IT's descsion we would have found something that fit the bill, but all we got was a crappy 30+ year old system. Hell this thing belongs in a museum, and the fact that its older than me makes me wonder what the hell were they thinking?
How can they make IT decisions without IT on board? Do they make marketing decisions without getting the marketing department's opinion too?
The closest thing that's happened in my company is that marketing and sales went ahead and bought a bunch of iPads without consulting IT, and then expected IT to completely support them - including app installation, etc. Damn how I loathe iOS. Stupidest 'smart' OS in history.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: soop on July 02, 2012, 10:13:48 PM
You know what you need to do? Hire a load of IT guys that support AS4000 without telling HR. If that's the way they want to roll.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: BigusSchmuck on July 03, 2012, 02:58:34 AM
Well if it was IT's descsion we would have found something that fit the bill, but all we got was a crappy 30+ year old system. Hell this thing belongs in a museum, and the fact that its older than me makes me wonder what the hell were they thinking?
How can they make IT decisions without IT on board? Do they make marketing decisions without getting the marketing department's opinion too?
The closest thing that's happened in my company is that marketing and sales went ahead and bought a bunch of iPads without consulting IT, and then expected IT to completely support them - including app installation, etc. Damn how I loathe iOS. Stupidest 'smart' OS in history.
This isn't the first time they have done this. They tried to tell us that we shouldn't be building pcs anymore and that we should go completely to the white box solution. So what do they do? Buy a bunch of cheapo dells and wonder why they all have various issues. Half of them we sent back and now we are back building our own pcs due to this blunder. Call it old school, but out here in the sticks we build our own due to there is literally no big electronics store let alone a Dell store. Back on subject, found out this morning that this thing supposedly supports Cartrol, but we have to do some sort of crazy back end shit to get it to convert over whereas before it was pretty straight forward to do. Also, credit cards can't be stored on this system due to it being non pcicompliant, so we are still stuck using two different systems old and new. Ugh, yet another crazy day.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: soop on July 03, 2012, 03:34:25 AM
If I were you, I'd get the head of IT to report to someone on the board and get whoever's responsible in marketing fired. This is a stupendously idiotic move to be making in these troubled times.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: SignOfZeta on July 03, 2012, 06:29:48 AM
My company uses Dell's for almost everything and...dang they sell some cheap as shit to their corporate clients. I mean, this stuff is CRAP. The laptop power supplies are always dying, the ports blow out, the keyboards and mice are just total f*cking garbage...its depressing that stuff this sad is even being built.
When you see what they are charging for these things and you wonder how they can even build them at all. I mean, $600 for a current-gen ship set and a 20" monitor? Like...how?
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: kazekirifx on July 03, 2012, 02:29:07 PM
I wish we built our own. That would be sweet.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: BigusSchmuck on July 05, 2012, 04:08:31 AM
Its more out of necessity and practicality than anything. Closest Best Buy or even Dell is like 200 miles west in Portland Oregon and if someone's machine went down, they would be down at least 24-48 hours to wait for a replacement vs we can get it done in a fraction of that. Not only that, but its cheaper in the long run.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: kazekirifx on July 05, 2012, 01:56:51 PM
Closest Best Buy or even Dell is like 200 miles west in Portland Oregon and if someone's machine went down, they would be down at least 24-48 hours to wait for a replacement vs we can get it done in a fraction of that.
Why is that really an issue? Just mail order. Maintenance would have to be send-away too of course, but just keep some spares around. If they're all the same model you can just put the end user's hard drive in a spare and they're up and running again.
I know it's easier said than done though. Building our own would be sweet too...
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: geise on July 05, 2012, 11:59:21 PM
Actually Dell workstation are pretty rad. Our dell precision workstation never have issues and have top of the line specs. They seem really well built. Laptops on the other hand I will never ever touch from dell. I got burned years ago buying one for my wife. Past five years it's been Vaio and all is well. Every manufacturer builds shit that's going to have issues, it just seems Dell it's usually more the case with their laptops.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: soop on July 06, 2012, 12:20:53 AM
Actually Dell workstation are pretty rad. Our dell precision workstation never have issues and have top of the line specs. They seem really well built. Laptops on the other hand I will never ever touch from dell. I got burned years ago buying one for my wife. Past five years it's been Vaio and all is well. Every manufacturer builds shit that's going to have issues, it just seems Dell it's usually more the case with their laptops.
Dell Laptops are teh suck. I'm using one right now (work). The thing about places like Dell is they know most consumers only focus on HDD space, Processor speed (in Mhz), and the amount of RAM. So they buy the cheapest components available in huge bulk, and use them as widely as possible. And that results in all sorts of bottlenecks throughout the system that you don't get in a (well built) custom built PC. So even though Dell seem cheap for what they are a "lower spec" machine will often outperform a Dell that should trump it.
As for Vaio's they're expensive for what they are, and pretty much for vain shallow people who are not quite pompous enough for a Mac.
Which is why I have 3 of them in my house.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: geise on July 06, 2012, 01:38:53 AM
Hehe. That's funny since I just bought a 14" vaio for my wife straight from sonystyle's web page for $469 with a: 500gb hd i5 2.5ghz (3rd generation) 6gig ddr3 1333 ram upgradeable to 16 dedicated 1gig nvidia 410 windows 7 64 bit home
If you go to their web page they have stuff on clearance for cheap. Ordering straight from sony is cheaper than going on newegg. Sony doesn't need to markup their own product to make some profit.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: soop on July 06, 2012, 02:50:52 AM
WOW O___O
That's an incredible deal. I got my tiny netbook recently for £250, but I'm very happy with it :)
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: BigusSchmuck on July 06, 2012, 11:14:30 AM
Closest Best Buy or even Dell is like 200 miles west in Portland Oregon and if someone's machine went down, they would be down at least 24-48 hours to wait for a replacement vs we can get it done in a fraction of that.
Why is that really an issue? Just mail order. Maintenance would have to be send-away too of course, but just keep some spares around. If they're all the same model you can just put the end user's hard drive in a spare and they're up and running again.
I know it's easier said than done though. Building our own would be sweet too...
The problem is that any machine outside of this office isn't on our domain and they are only getting backed up locally. Good news though, we finally got some fiber wired up so we can start getting these machines on the domain and start getting replication servers out there.
Hehe. That's funny since I just bought a 14" vaio for my wife straight from sonystyle's web page for $469 with a: 500gb hd i5 2.5ghz (3rd generation) 6gig ddr3 1333 ram upgradeable to 16 dedicated 1gig nvidia 410 windows 7 64 bit home
If you go to their web page they have stuff on clearance for cheap. Ordering straight from sony is cheaper than going on newegg. Sony doesn't need to markup their own product to make some profit.
If you got a newegg business account, you get all sorts of great deals. We were building quadcore amd athlons for around $200ish with windows xp or about $400 with Windows 7. Nice thing about amd am3 boards they are forwards compatible so we can put am3+ cpus in them (trust me I researched on which ones can do this) with a simple bios update and save even more money by doing this. I also suggest getting 2 hard drives these days as it seems that drives crash way more frequently than they used to.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: BigusSchmuck on August 17, 2012, 01:58:38 PM
Update on the IBM BS. After a month of going live, this thing hasn't worked out at all especially when it comes to doing statements. Since the company I'm working for is a CO OP, you would think this software would cover and do everything management wants and more right? Wrong, the supposed "interface" with our old Eagle, SSI and cartrol it only took HALF of our customers over into the new system and the ones it did bring over it DIDN'T bring over the signatures which is very important to our credit department. To top things off, a big portion of the cartrol data (transactions) were completely lost to antiquity. Mark off another $10,000+ in transactions that will never come back. Second, our agronomy department is on SSI so when they moved their invoices over some people got double charge and some people didn't get moved over because their account numbers were too long for this IBM crap to read. Take another $20,000 lost in transactions. Good news on the SSI stuff though, its still on the old system but they just can't bill them out so all is not completely lost. Finally, our retail stuff and petro had yet another similar issue with the customer transactions not going completely over on the other side. Not sure on the total loss on this is, but its easily in the $100s of thousands of dollars. Bottom line, under no circumstances do you let a dumb redneck accountant and Grain guy do ANY IT decisions, its just going to bite you in the arse in the end. Oh yeah, did I mention we had to buy $10,000 worth of printers just so they can work with this system because it doesn't like anything at all except Lexmark printers? Ugh.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: Tatsujin on August 18, 2012, 12:43:55 AM
HAL
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: soop on August 18, 2012, 12:48:28 AM
Holy shit. Those people need to be fired.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: BigusSchmuck on September 13, 2012, 08:40:23 AM
I about shit my drawers when I read this: http://www.vulture.com/2012/09/brad-pitt-to-produce-ibm-and-the-holocaust.html
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: SignOfZeta on September 13, 2012, 09:15:08 AM
I about shit my drawers when I read this: http://www.vulture.com/2012/09/brad-pitt-to-produce-ibm-and-the-holocaust.html
Wow, I never thought that book would be made into a movie.
Well, it's not made yet, I guess. We'll see. With this and the upcoming movie about Turing, a lot more people are going to get some real computer knowledge dropped on them in a short span of time.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: Arkhan on September 13, 2012, 09:23:11 AM
This is where all the appletards go
OMG STEVE JOBS DIDN'T INVENT COMPUTERS?
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: SignOfZeta on September 13, 2012, 09:35:14 AM
I don't think there are many people like that. Once computer knowledge drops below a certain level they don't even know who Jobs was.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: thesteve on September 13, 2012, 11:56:46 AM
as400 works well for forms/inventory tracking windows can do it as well, but can be less reliable. note that as400 talks to dumb terminals, and windows runs terminal emulators
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: BigusSchmuck on September 14, 2012, 03:00:49 AM
as400 works well for forms/inventory tracking windows can do it as well, but can be less reliable. note that as400 talks to dumb terminals, and windows runs terminal emulators
What crack are you smoking? The shit doesn't work very well at ALL. It bugs out and clears your system setup on the windows client, can't interface with anything worth a damn very well (cartrol, Epicore and a few others), have to get Lexmark printers for multiple tray function (already spent close to $5,000 on this), people get locked out on this DAILY, and to top things off this damn thing even with its Windows front end for the grain scale interface you can't even do a reprint of a scale ticket (kind of important for truck drivers). This thing is quite possibly the worst mistake this company has ever done and I just hope by the end of the year I'll still have a job considering there will probably be all sorts of layoffs if the grain department didn't at least make enough money to cover this mistake. And if the higher ups decide to push this thing on Agronomy and Payroll, there will be hell to pay for doing so. Knowing my luck, they'll start hiring a bunch of greying IBM guys to support this on site 24/7 because thats what I'm doing right now.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: thesteve on September 14, 2012, 04:21:28 AM
I was speaking from experience at a former employer. as to what it will and wont do, thats all in how its setup.
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: SignOfZeta on September 14, 2012, 05:53:51 AM
AS400 was perfectly fine for decades. It just isn't any f*cking good at all now because 1) unless you have a very specific application it's going to require all sorts of special hardware and software just to interface with all your modern stuff and 2) nobody knows how to use it except angry old dudes who got into the business when it actually paid something and will retire at any second.
I do still kind of wish they used it for ATMs though...
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: BigusSchmuck on September 14, 2012, 06:40:39 AM
AS400 was perfectly fine for decades. It just isn't any f*cking good at all now because 1) unless you have a very specific application it's going to require all sorts of special hardware and software just to interface with all your modern stuff and 2) nobody knows how to use it except angry old dudes who got into the business when it actually paid something and will retire at any second.
I do still kind of wish they used it for ATMs though...
They use it for gas systems, thats enough. :P Although the interface with gas boy sucks mad balls...
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: majors on September 14, 2012, 10:02:04 AM
They use it for gas systems, thats enough. :P Although the interface with gas boy sucks mad balls...
GVR in the house? I had a contract at Gilbarco for a year and some. On the deploment team for pre-production(read: beta) Passport software. All running shitty Windows boxes with modems for RDC (I had forgotten 56k speed!). AS/400 versus XP?...6 of 1, half dozen of another...
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: BigusSchmuck on September 15, 2012, 11:02:21 AM
They use it for gas systems, thats enough. :P Although the interface with gas boy sucks mad balls...
GVR in the house? I had a contract at Gilbarco for a year and some. On the deploment team for pre-production(read: beta) Passport software. All running shitty Windows boxes with modems for RDC (I had forgotten 56k speed!). AS/400 versus XP?...6 of 1, half dozen of another...
Yeah we still have a few modems in the IT room. Its been my mission these past 2 years to finally retire them just for the simple reason they are noisy and sooooooo out of date (56k would be a luxury with these things). I will say that we finally did get rid of the old dot matrix continuous feed printer, gawd that thing was noisy. Anywho, the AS400 drama continues as people now realize they have to manually clear out their printer ques. Oh joy...
Title: Re: What do you guys think of IBM?
Post by: roflmao on September 17, 2012, 11:52:50 AM
AS400 was perfectly fine for decades. It just isn't any f*cking good at all now because 1) unless you have a very specific application it's going to require all sorts of special hardware and software just to interface with all your modern stuff and 2) nobody knows how to use it except angry old dudes who got into the business when it actually paid something and will retire at any second.
I do still kind of wish they used it for ATMs though...
A couple of years ago I developed a website that interfaced with a database on an AS400. That was fun. Almost.