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NEC PC-Engine/SuperGrafx => PC Engine/SuperGrafx Discussion => Topic started by: Bonknuts on August 21, 2006, 05:16:31 PM
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Bonknuts on August 21, 2006, 05:16:31 PM
Ok, I confirmed Gulliver Boy is an SCD/ACD game.
Anyone have any other suspicious game that I should check out/confirm(w/debugger)?
[I'll edit this post to add titles]
list so far:
Gulliver Boy (verified) Flash Hiders (verified) Emerald Dragon (verified) 3x3 eyes (verified) Popful mail (verified)
-Rich
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: PC Gaijin on August 21, 2006, 05:51:03 PM
How does Gulliver Boy make use of the Arcard Card? Can you tell? For the video sequences? Or just less loading?
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Bonknuts on August 21, 2006, 06:30:45 PM
I haven't figured that out yet. All I know is the games reads and writes to the arcade ports($1A00-$1A40) from what the debugger tells me(breakpoints). It does this during the FMV sequences and in game as well.
I played Xanadu II till the second area and it doesn't use the AC.
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Buster D on August 21, 2006, 06:39:45 PM
The Saturn version of Gulliver Boy seems a bit easier to find on the cheap, does the PCE version have any advantages over it?
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Bonknuts on August 21, 2006, 06:57:24 PM
Probably not, though I've not play the saturn version. One could guess though.
Update to Gulliver Boy: Seems the AC caches the dungeons/town/overworld. Once they load, they don't load again (only the first area tested).
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Tatsujin on August 21, 2006, 06:58:05 PM
3x3 Eyes as well!
the ACD only support the Video sequences (the loading time is almost the same, but the lengths of the sequence changes (unbroken squences).
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: TR0N on August 21, 2006, 07:07:16 PM
Popful Mail is just does more for the animated sceens.
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: vestcoat on August 21, 2006, 07:59:39 PM
sorry, i posted something in the wrong topic. please ignore this.
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: SignOfZeta on August 22, 2006, 12:26:42 AM
3x3 eyes Linda3 Emerald Dragon Brandish Princess Maker 2 Private Eye Doll Popful Mail Wrestle Angels Double Impact Askua 120% Debut The Atlus Vasteel 2 Formation Socker 95 Super Real Mahjongg PII/II Custom Super Real Mahjongg PC Custom Something called...Majan Sword Priness Quest...? Something like that. Graduation II Flash Hiders
...and a few I can't read. The complete list is in the FAQ here:
mysql> select name,format from games where format like '%ACD%' order by format,name; +-------------------------------------------+---------+ | name | format | +-------------------------------------------+---------+ | Battlefield '94 In Super Battle Dream | ACD | | Fire Pro Female Wrestling (WOWOW vs. JWP) | ACD | | Garou Densetsu 2 | ACD | | Garou Densetsu Special | ACD | | Ginga Fukei Densetsu Sapphire | ACD | | Jong Shin Densetsu | ACD | | Kabuki Itouryodan | ACD | | Mad Stalker Full Metal Force | ACD | | Madou Monogatari I Honou no Sotsuenji | ACD | | Ryuuko No Ken | ACD | | Strider Hiryuu | ACD | | World Heroes 2 | ACD | | 3 x 3 Eyes Sanjiyan Hensei | SCD/ACD | | Atlas (The) - Renaissance Voyager | SCD/ACD | | Brandish | SCD/ACD | | Eikan Wa Kimini | SCD/ACD | | Formation Soccer '95 | SCD/ACD | | J. League Tremendous Soccer '94 | SCD/ACD | | Linda Cube | SCD/ACD | | Mahjong Sword Princess Quest Gaiden | SCD/ACD | | Popful Mail | SCD/ACD | | Princess Maker 2 | SCD/ACD | | Private Eye Doll | SCD/ACD | | Sexy Idol Mahjong Fashion Monogatari | SCD/ACD | | Sotsugyou II Neo Generation | SCD/ACD | | Super Real Mahjong P II & III Custom | SCD/ACD | | Super Real Mahjong P V Custom | SCD/ACD | | Tanjou Debut | SCD/ACD | | Vasteel 2 | SCD/ACD | | Wrestling Angels Double Impact | SCD/ACD | +-------------------------------------------+---------+
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Kaminari on August 22, 2006, 03:34:18 AM
The complete list:
o ACD
Fire Pro Joshi Dōmu Chōjo Taisen: Zenjo vs JWP Garō Densetsu 2: Aratanaru Tatakai Garō Densetsu Special Ginga Fukei Densetsu Sapphire Janshin Densetsu Madō Monogatari: Honō no Sotsu Enji Mad Stalker: Full Metal Force Ryūko no Ken Shin Nihon Pro Wrestling '94: Battlefield in Tōkyō Dōmu Strider Hiryū Tengai Makyō: Kabuki Ittō Ryōdan World Heroes 2
o ASCD
3x3 Eyes: Sanjiyan Henjō Asuka 120% Maxima: Burning Fest Brandish Eikan wa Kimi ni Emerald Dragon Flash Hiders Formation Soccer '95: Della Serie A J-League Tremendous Soccer '94 Kūsō Kagaku Sekai Gulliver Boy Linda³ Mahjong Sword: Princess Quest Gaiden Popful Mail Princess Maker Princess Maker 2 Private Eye Doll Sexy Idol Mahjong: Fashion Monogatari Sotsugyō 2: Neo Generation Super Real Mahjong P2-3 Custom Super Real Mahjong P5 Custom Tanjō The Atlas: Renaissance Voyager Vasteel 2 Wrestling Angels: Double Impact
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Odonadon on August 22, 2006, 06:30:17 AM
Wow, what in the heck is Linda Cube? I'm guessing hentai disc or dating sim?
OD
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: SignOfZeta on August 22, 2006, 10:57:06 AM
Quote from: "Odonadon"
Wow, what in the heck is Linda Cube? I'm guessing hentai disc or dating sim?
OD
No way, its a really f-ed up RPG that looks awesome. I want it but its expensive. It was ported to Saturn too, but I'd like to have the PCE version.
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Vanquish on August 22, 2006, 12:46:29 PM
is it worth an arcade card pro? I mean... are there any "must have" game in arcade card format? I love R Type
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: runinruder on August 22, 2006, 01:05:11 PM
I consider Madou Monogatari and Sapphire to be "musts," but they both cost a ton, and it seems to be getting harder and harder to find either one (at least if you want the real things).
I just recently acquired the Kabuki fighter and haven't had a chance to play it yet, but it looks pretty darn good.
The 3X3 Eyes cinemas look absolutely amazing with the AC.
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Vanquish on August 22, 2006, 01:08:07 PM
i have never played saphire. what kind of game is it? and what makes it special? better than my beloved r type? hehe
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Tatsujin on August 22, 2006, 01:26:03 PM
seems, that i own almost the whole ACD-stuff^^
for the ginga fukei densetsu sapphire:
it's kind a experimental v-shooter which uses almost all the 2D special FX just possible (even motion 3D pre-render)! with hard/soft riff BGM a la gate/winds of thunder. since you travelling in time, almost every level looks totally different! also there are a lot of huge mid and level end bosses (and if i say huge,i mean really HUGE!!) in my opinion, in the view of technical issue, the best 8/16bit console soft ever made! (exept of AES stuff).
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Joe Redifer on August 22, 2006, 02:34:57 PM
What's the difference in Flash Hiders? I just tried it both ways and spot ZERO noticeable differences anywhere, even in load time or # of loadings.
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: SignOfZeta on August 22, 2006, 04:21:03 PM
Quote from: "Joe Redifer"
What's the difference in Flash Hiders? I just tried it both ways and spot ZERO noticeable differences anywhere, even in load time or # of loadings.
I think its something *really* minor, like a voice sample during a win pose or something like that.
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Vanquish on August 23, 2006, 12:52:06 AM
wow those were great graphics!! does it requiry ACD or does it work with SCD also?
But i must say something... those sound effects are crap :P hehehe (dont kill me!! hehehe)
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: cozzie on August 23, 2006, 12:59:19 AM
I think myself Thunderforce 4 on the Megadrive (Genesis) is a lot better to play and look at than Sapphire. The music and graphical affects are awesome. Plus it can be bought for next to nothing. :D
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Bonknuts on August 23, 2006, 04:42:24 AM
TF4 is awesome with some awesome pixel art(gfx) like the cloud/ocean level, but some of the later graphics are just average-to-good - if memory serves me right. The game has a hard contrast look, works for the most of the game. The special effects are great too, but that game consequencely has some serious slowdown. The music was great, but the quality of it was mostly staticy/grainy/hissy - trend a lot of later generation MD titles tended to lean towards. I still prefer TF3(MD version) over TF4 :P
Thanks for the AC list guys - I just want to verify them and any others that might be been in question.
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Keranu on August 23, 2006, 08:44:02 AM
I never did understand what was so graphically impressive about TF3 and 4 with the exception of a couple levels. It's way too dithered for my technical eyes :( . Gate of Thunder's graphics in my opinion improved over TF3 and 4's greatly making everything look a lot more polished and cleaner.
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: GUTS on August 23, 2006, 12:50:44 PM
Keranu's technical eyes=only sees how many colors are on screen, ignores everything else. I need to get another copy of Gate of Thunder, I remember it being a big let down after I'd played Thunder Force IV. It was a great shooter, but I remember thinking it looked like Sol Feace, haha.
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Keranu on August 23, 2006, 01:15:39 PM
I see everything else and the only thing TFIII's graphics had going for it were parallax layers really. The wave effect thing was kind of nice, but I also thought it was kind of too fast and annoying. When you abuse dithering, it just looks ugly man.
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Joe Redifer on August 23, 2006, 02:12:44 PM
I agree that Sapphire's sound effects are horrible little munches of static pain. Even on real hardware. People who argue for the PCE's technical merits should stay far away from this game when coming to the sound part of the argument!
Music is pretty good, though!
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Keranu on August 23, 2006, 02:15:02 PM
What's so bad about Sapphire sounds :? ? I thought they sounded really good actually. Not quite as good as Gate of Thunder, but still nicer than most console shooters at the time.
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: runinruder on August 23, 2006, 04:04:53 PM
Aside from the "famous" lava stage, Thunder Force III looks like trash.
Lightening Force, on the other hand, does look awesome. I definitely enjoy looking at its amazing graphics when the game slows to a halt in, like, every stage.
As Keranu alluded to, Gate looks sharper and cleaner than both of them.
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Keranu on August 23, 2006, 04:08:41 PM
Ameen.
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Joe Redifer on August 23, 2006, 04:47:11 PM
The sound effects in Sapphire when firing your shots sound like static, or maybe someone scratching a textured wall. They certainly don't sound like weapons being fired. And they are quite a bit louder than the music. The PCE can do much better sounds than these. Sapphire's effects sound very abbrasive.
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Bonknuts on August 23, 2006, 04:59:52 PM
I agree with Joe on the sound of effects of Sapphire - atleast when it comes to the weapon sound effects - ahh!
I played TF3 whe it first came out, so I'm probably biased towards it. I played GOT before TF4 ( or Lightning Force). I still LOVE the sin wave effect in the fire level - it's soooo smooth 8)
Keranu, you normally don't see the dither on the real genesis - not like the emus. It's kinda of like cheating... eer uhm deceiving... eer I mean filtering.
It was a great shooter, but I remember thinking it looked like Sol Feace, haha.
Sol Feace was a cool game, but graphically bland in comparison to GOT.
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Keranu on August 23, 2006, 05:04:22 PM
Quote from: "Bonknuts"
Keranu, you normally don't see the dither on the real genesis - not like the emus. It's kinda of like cheating... eer uhm deceiving... eer I mean filtering.
Oh no, I can still spot dithering on a TV, I do it all the time ;) . Dithering usually doesn't bother me, just when they overdue it like in Thunder Force. But in a game like L-Dis where the colorful sky background uses dithering for each shade, that looks nice and I don't mind.
Sol Feace rules, I love that game.
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Joe Redifer on August 23, 2006, 06:31:47 PM
I really don't think either Thunder Force 2, 3 or 4 used dithering in an obtrusive way at all. If you want to see dithering that will paralyze you, check out Eternal Champions on either cart or CD. X-Men is pretty bad as are Greendog, Chakan, and many others.
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Keranu on August 23, 2006, 06:37:21 PM
All those games you mentioned are kings of dithering :lol: . I still love to play X-Men and Greendog.
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Joe Redifer on August 23, 2006, 06:41:01 PM
I was really annoyed when Sega (or somebody) tried to say that Eternal Champions CD put somewhere around 256 colors on the screen at one time. NOPE! They were counting the dithering as colors. Some also say Snatcher put 128 onscreen or something like that. I have seen no evidence of this, either. Man we're starting to talk like the PCE vs SNES & Genesis thread.
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Tatsujin on August 23, 2006, 06:41:54 PM
Quote from: "Keranu"
What's so bad about Sapphire sounds :? ? I thought they sounded really good actually. Not quite as good as Gate of Thunder, but still nicer than most console shooters at the time.
they tlaking only about the SE not the BGM, which i have to agree is te most disatvantage of the game (analog ray xanber III) horrible! but the 2nd fighter from the left side istn't that noisy at all ;)
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Keranu on August 23, 2006, 06:45:58 PM
I know they were talking about the SE for Sapphire and I actually like the SE in it :) . That one sound effect in Rayxamber III (some yellow laser weapon) feels like a needle being pushed into the ear :shock: .
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Tatsujin on August 23, 2006, 06:59:32 PM
Quote from: "Keranu"
I see everything else and the only thing TFIII's graphics had going for it were parallax layers really. The wave effect thing was kind of nice, but I also thought it was kind of too fast and annoying. When you abuse dithering, it just looks ugly man.
i have to totally agree with keranu. though TFIII was one of my fav. shooters ever, especially regarded to its age ('90), it's just looking tiny against a Gate of thunder, which of course was released 2 years later! TF IV looks awesome in the first stage only, impressive parallax etc. but is jerking a lot though. the coming levels really looking nice, but the facts keranu mentioned, puts the game much below the standard from the elite shmups on PC Engine like GoT, WoT Sapphire, which appearing in a much more shine & clear style (with all the droped shadows of the top and bottom obstacles in GoT, changeing the BG several times in each levels, huge and nice drawed explosions etc). for example in TFIII they made the mistake, that the explosions starts red in the core and getting yellow outside > horrible!
i mean really, in view of technically aspects a sapphire is above all of them (exept the SE).
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Joe Redifer on August 23, 2006, 07:01:53 PM
Quote from: "Tatsujin"
TF IV looks awesome in the first stage only, impressive parallax etc. but is jerking a lot though.
Are you playing on an emulator? My real copy doesn't jerk or stutter anywhere in the game. Don't blame a system for an emulator's shortcomings.
Quote from: "Tatsujin"
in TFIII they made the mistake, that the explosions starts red in the core and getting yellow outside > horrible!
Yes, this is completely unacceptable and as a result I now refuse to play the game because I don't want my eyes to bleed! Seriously though, this is such a minor complaint.
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Tatsujin on August 23, 2006, 07:20:49 PM
i never play on a emulators! just sucks^^
Quote from: "Tatsujin"
though TFIII was one of my fav. shooters ever, especially regarded to its age ('90), .
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Keranu on August 23, 2006, 07:46:53 PM
Nice points, Tatsujin.
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Tatsujin on August 24, 2006, 04:26:51 PM
maybe joe is playing his TFIV on a some kind of uber-hardware :wink: ! fact is, it's stuttering a lot during the whole game! still it is an amazing shooter, no doubt!
the PCEs most biggest advantage is its technical issue. good programmed PCE shmups almost never stutters or flickers. that why excellent programmed elite shmups like GoT, WoT, Sapphire, star parodia etc. appearing in a dynamic way which i almost couldn't find on other 8/16bitter.
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Keranu on August 24, 2006, 06:03:40 PM
GoT blows my mind in so many ways, and one of them is the way how it's hard to spot flicker in that game despite how many sprites are in a line. And I don't recall slowdown once in the whole game - unbelievable.
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Tatsujin on August 24, 2006, 06:22:43 PM
anyway one of my fav. shooter alltime in any points of view! as you just said, Unbelievable! and it is in all ways!
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Bonknuts on August 24, 2006, 08:49:29 PM
I heard the saturn version of TF4 doesn't have the slowdown. Plus the saturn has better quality TV output signal than the Gen. I wonder how much it goes for on saturn.
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Keranu on August 24, 2006, 08:49:39 PM
There is not one bad thing I can say about Gates, honestly. It's a perfect game to me. :)
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Tatsujin on August 25, 2006, 10:30:59 PM
absolut aight! but there is a very small issue i wish it could be better made, that's the difference of the SE/BGM volume, since the BGM sometimes getting overtoned by the SE. just a separate adjustable volume of SE/BGM function in the option would be the best, but at that time not really common^^
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Joe Redifer on August 25, 2006, 11:45:34 PM
Quote from: "Keranu"
There is not one bad thing I can say about Gates, honestly. It's a perfect game to me. :)
We all know it would be 10x better if it were "John Madden's Gate of Thunder".
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Tatsujin on August 26, 2006, 03:49:39 AM
but only as a US release I believe :lol:
and also plz redesign the cover art which was one of the best in US releases on turbo games ever!
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: guyjin on August 26, 2006, 05:37:32 AM
wasn't the us cover of GoT basically the same as the Japanese?
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: SignOfZeta on August 26, 2006, 06:09:29 AM
Quote from: "guyjin"
wasn't the us cover of GoT basically the same as the Japanese?
I think he was being sarcastic, and saying that for it to be a fitting US release, it should have a horible cover like virtually all other US releases....and it should be endorsed by John Madden.
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: SignOfZeta on August 26, 2006, 06:46:39 AM
Quote from: "Tatsujin"
absolut aight! but there is a very small issue i wish it could be better made, that's the difference of the SE/BGM volume, since the BGM sometimes getting overtoned by the SE
Yeah, that's the case with a great deal of PCE games, from my experience.
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Keranu on August 26, 2006, 09:32:42 AM
Quote from: "Tatsujin"
absolut aight! but there is a very small issue i wish it could be better made, that's the difference of the SE/BGM volume, since the BGM sometimes getting overtoned by the SE. just a separate adjustable volume of SE/BGM function in the option would be the best, but at that time not really common^^
This used to bother me a little some years ago, but I am used to it and dig it :D .
Quote from: "Joe"
We all know it would be 10x better if it were "John Madden's Gate of Thunder".
Oh most definitely, that would've been sweet! 8)
The cover between the USA and Japanese versions were different and the USA one does look a little cheesy, but I didn't think the Japanese cover was that great either.
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Black Tiger on August 28, 2006, 03:35:35 PM
Quote from: "Joe Redifer"
Quote from: "Keranu"
There is not one bad thing I can say about Gates, honestly. It's a perfect game to me. :)
We all know it would be 10x better if it were "John Madden's Gate of Thunder".
Or how about "John Madden Duo CD Gate Of Thunder"?
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: esteban on August 28, 2006, 05:12:34 PM
Tangent: OK, this tangent deals with the relative volume of sound effects vs. music. While this was annoying in some CD games, I was always really upset when cartridge titles would prioritize sound fx over the chip tunes. The result? The music is playing fine, but as soon as you shoot (or use a bomb, or blow up an enemy, etc.) one or more channels of the soundtrack would drop out. I understand why programmers did this, but still...
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: GUTS on August 28, 2006, 06:06:39 PM
Yeah a lot of games do that when they play digitized voice samples or effects, it's really annoying.
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Keranu on August 28, 2006, 09:02:00 PM
That would bother me as well. I slightly recall me playing some game with sweet music and actually having to pause the game once to hear through the good part of the song so the song wouldn't get messed up by incoming sound effects. Good point, young Steven. :)
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Black Tiger on August 31, 2006, 11:45:39 AM
Quote from: "Keranu"
That would bother me as well. I slightly recall me playing some game with sweet music and actually having to pause the game once to hear through the good part of the song so the song wouldn't get messed up by incoming sound effects. Good point, young Steven. :)
It was a small price to pay during the 8-bit generation. Otherwise, you might only have 2 channel music. :wink:
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Joe Redifer on August 31, 2006, 01:00:20 PM
Quote from: "Keranu"
That would bother me as well. I slightly recall me playing some game with sweet music and actually having to pause the game once to hear through the good part of the song so the song wouldn't get messed up by incoming sound effects. Good point, young Steven. :)
This happened a lot even in 16-bit games. I heard often on the Genesis which had more sound channels than you can count on your fingers and toes (if you've had a few lawnmower and woodshop accidents, anyway). I wasn't a huge SNES fan, but with only 8 channels wouldn't it have done it as well?
Title: Arcade card game list thread
Post by: Keranu on August 31, 2006, 06:30:27 PM
I'm pretty sure the game I was referring to was a 16-bit game, either for Genesis or Turbo.