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NEC TG-16/TE/TurboDuo => TG/PCE Repair/Mod Discussion => Topic started by: Flavor on May 02, 2012, 03:05:41 AM
Title: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis/SNES Controllers
Post by: Flavor on May 02, 2012, 03:05:41 AM
Let me start off by saying that this may not be in the right forum. I have a few things going on here. I could see it as homebrew, a console modification, a WTB request, etc. If you're a mod and you think this would reach the target audience better in another forum category, please let me know or go ahead and move it.
First, I'll give a quick background. In the last year, I made a trade to acquire a TurboDuo. I don't have many games for it, but I'm not a huge gamer, anyway. I'm more of a tinkerer/hacker/maker/coder type. I've been doing hardware projects for some other consoles recently (Neo Geo Pocket, Atari Lynx, etc.) and if you want, you can see some of my stuff at http://www.youtube.com/cfc2ngpc or http://www.flashmasta.com/.
Lately, my daughters and I have been playing the Duo. They mainly want to play Bonk's Adventure/Revenge at the moment, but I'd like to find some multiplayer games for us. The drawback here is that I only have the 1 controller, and buying a TurboTap and extra controllers is not going to be cheap. I started looking at building my own TurboTap, which I think I can do fairly easily.
The downside is that to prototype it properly, I may need to get a real TurboTap and maybe some controllers. Prototyping it may end up costing more than just buying one, but that's less interesting.
So, why am I telling you all this? I need some input.
First, if anyone has a broken/worn/ugly/etc. TurboTap that they'd want to let go for cheap, please let me know. I am also very interested in obtaining some cheap controllers (again broken, worn out, dirty, faded, etc is fine).
Next, I want to address the "Genesis" part of the title. I wasn't sure if I should put that in there, but I thought it might get some people to read this far. :)
TG-16/PCE controllers seem a bit expensive. There are other controllers out there, like Genesis ones, that are pretty affordable, not to mention the fact that many of us would already own a couple. If I'm playing a multiplayer TG-16 game, maybe I don't care if the extra players have an authentic TG/PCE controller. If they're using a Genesis controller to play Bomberman, that should be fine.
So, I'm thinking of making the "Poor Man's TurboTap" (working title) have one PCE connector and 4 Genesis connectors. What do you think? Would you want something like that? I'm sure a lot of you already have a Tap and controllers, but what's your take on this? Is it blasphemy to hook a Sega controller to beloved NEC? Is it cool to add extra options? Would you want to own something like this?
So, if you have opinions, please respond. If you have hardware that you'd like to donate to the cause, please let me know!
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis Controllers
Post by: Duo_R on May 02, 2012, 03:18:10 AM
Try NES controllers, easier to convert and have a more similar button layout. See the link in my signature for instructions. Hopefully u can get a tap on the cheap.
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis Controllers
Post by: Flavor on May 02, 2012, 03:38:40 AM
Try NES controllers, easier to convert and have a more similar button layout. See the link in my signature for instructions. Hopefully u can get a tap on the cheap.
Thanks! I think I saw that writeup already in my initial searches.
I do agree that NES is much more similar as far as layout goes. However, Genesis is appealing for cost reasons. The way I am thinking about doing it, I would not have to mod the actual Genesis controller at all. The main downside is that the Genesis doesn't have a SELECT button, so maybe the A or C button would be SELECT. Also, the Genesis controller socket is much easier to source.
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis Controllers
Post by: soop on May 02, 2012, 04:05:48 AM
Try NES controllers, easier to convert and have a more similar button layout. See the link in my signature for instructions. Hopefully u can get a tap on the cheap.
Thanks! I think I saw that writeup already in my initial searches.
I do agree that NES is much more similar as far as layout goes. However, Genesis is appealing for cost reasons. The way I am thinking about doing it, I would not have to mod the actual Genesis controller at all. The main downside is that the Genesis doesn't have a SELECT button, so maybe the A or C button would be SELECT. Also, the Genesis controller socket is much easier to source.
There exists a converter called the XHE-3, which can be used to convert Genesis pads to PC Engine, but B doesn't work, and obviously that leaves you missing start or select. The reason for this is that it's intended for use with the X68000 and I think MSX, which are similar but different.
However... when you're talking in terms of cost, what's a ballpark figure? I've noticed that TG-16 pheripherals seem to be very expensive (like the extension cables!), but I don't really think PCE stuff is as expensive.
So what I propose would be to get/make a TG/PCE converter and then get some cheap Japanese pads and multitap at a fraction of the cost. It would certainly save some work.
In fact, you could start with one of these: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/8-pin-cable-repair-pc-engine-game-controller-pad-/110868045566?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item19d0401efe and a DIN socket.
and then get a bunch of these: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/PC-Engine-JUNK-DUO-Controller-Pad-Import-JAPAN-Video-Game-1666-/221002878071?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3374cc4c77 (again, not sure if that's expensive to you)
And this http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/PC-Engine-JOY-TAP-3-Grafx-Import-Japanese-JAPAN-103-/220710739152?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3363629cd0 Or maybe a 5 port if your partner feels like joining in (recommended!)
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis Controllers
Post by: GohanX on May 02, 2012, 04:07:08 AM
If you can get a Genesis controller working on it, it would be cool. If you can get the 6 button arcade pad to work on PCE 6 button games, that would be friggin' sweet!
I think I'd prefer the regular PCE controller for 2 button stuff, but using the Sega pad on SF2 would be hot sex. I would imagine this would require some sort of black magic, as the programming for the 6 button controllers on both systems is pretty odd.
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis Controllers
Post by: soop on May 02, 2012, 04:24:59 AM
Try NES controllers, easier to convert and have a more similar button layout. See the link in my signature for instructions. Hopefully u can get a tap on the cheap.
I do agree that NES is much more similar as far as layout goes. However, Genesis is appealing for cost reasons. The way I am thinking about doing it, I would not have to mod the actual Genesis controller at all. The main downside is that the Genesis doesn't have a SELECT button, so maybe the A or C button would be SELECT. Also, the Genesis controller socket is much easier to source.
I see old NES controllers for sale constantly often times at cheap prices, Genesis controllers not nearly as much. Do you mean cost issues with modifying a NES pad, or the actual cost of the controllers themselves?
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis Controllers
Post by: Necromancer on May 02, 2012, 05:15:00 AM
Try NES controllers, easier to convert and have a more similar button layout. See the link in my signature for instructions. Hopefully u can get a tap on the cheap.
I do agree that NES is much more similar as far as layout goes. However, Genesis is appealing for cost reasons. The way I am thinking about doing it, I would not have to mod the actual Genesis controller at all. The main downside is that the Genesis doesn't have a SELECT button, so maybe the A or C button would be SELECT. Also, the Genesis controller socket is much easier to source.
I see old NES controllers for sale constantly often times at cheap prices, Genesis controllers not nearly as much. Do you mean cost issues with modifying a NES pad, or the actual cost of the controllers themselves?
Yea, I mean that (as far as I can tell) the cost of building an interface to the NES would be higher than what I'd need to build to interface with Genesis. I am still in the early design phase, though, so this sort of input is helpful.
I have seen Genesis controllers sell on eBay for like $2 each, so I think that's cheap. http://www.ebay.com/itm/120879810907
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis Controllers
Post by: DragonmasterDan on May 02, 2012, 05:31:39 AM
There exists a converter called the XHE-3, which can be used to convert Genesis pads to PC Engine, but B doesn't work, and obviously that leaves you missing start or select. The reason for this is that it's intended for use with the X68000 and I think MSX, which are similar but different.
However... when you're talking in terms of cost, what's a ballpark figure? I've noticed that TG-16 pheripherals seem to be very expensive (like the extension cables!), but I don't really think PCE stuff is as expensive.
So what I propose would be to get/make a TG/PCE converter and then get some cheap Japanese pads and multitap at a fraction of the cost. It would certainly save some work.
In fact, you could start with one of these: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/8-pin-cable-repair-pc-engine-game-controller-pad-/110868045566?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item19d0401efe and a DIN socket.
and then get a bunch of these: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/PC-Engine-JUNK-DUO-Controller-Pad-Import-JAPAN-Video-Game-1666-/221002878071?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3374cc4c77 (again, not sure if that's expensive to you)
And this http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/PC-Engine-JOY-TAP-3-Grafx-Import-Japanese-JAPAN-103-/220710739152?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3363629cd0 Or maybe a 5 port if your partner feels like joining in (recommended!)
I'm really open to ideas, so this is all good info. The XHE-3 sounds a lot like what I was thinking of building, except mine would be integrated with the turbotap device. I could make the converter standalone like the XHE-3 you described, but it wouldn't be as cheap to produce. After scouring the specs, I get why the B button would be left out. There's not a super-simple way to get all the logic for all the buttons. I'll have to see if I can find more about this XHE-3, but I'm guessing they're using some similar techniques to what I originally considered.
A ballpark figure might be say $30 for this TurboTap with built-in converter. So, if you had Genesis controllers already, you'd be set. If you didn't, it seems like you could get 4 for maybe $10 shipped if you went super-cheapo. That's $40 total.
Compare that to the links you showed me. We're talking about $20 for the TurboTap, and about $15-20 for each controller. That's $80 total on the low end, I think.
If you can get a Genesis controller working on it, it would be cool. If you can get the 6 button arcade pad to work on PCE 6 button games, that would be friggin' sweet!
I think I'd prefer the regular PCE controller for 2 button stuff, but using the Sega pad on SF2 would be hot sex. I would imagine this would require some sort of black magic, as the programming for the 6 button controllers on both systems is pretty odd.
6-button would be much more difficult, but I wouldn't rule it out. I can work on that. It would probably not be built into a TurboTap at that point, though. There is some fairly good documentation for the Genesis 6-button controllers. What about the PCE 6-button controllers. Is that well documented somewhere? Does anyone have a broken one that could be hacked up and operated on?
Keep in mind that I could also make just a TurboTap (probably not worthwhile since they're available) or just a stand-alone gamepad converter. If you see merit in either of these, that would be interesting to discuss, too.
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis Controllers
Post by: Keith Courage on May 02, 2012, 07:11:44 AM
I really think you would be best off just being patient and waiting to find some cheap controllers on ebay or possibly from any forums members here who may have extras. It is easy to find pc engine DUO taps going for around $10 on ebay. Also, if you are fine settling for standard white pc engine controllers that don't have rapid switches then you can usually find those for around 12-15 a piece.
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis Controllers
Post by: Flavor on May 02, 2012, 07:19:35 AM
I really think you would be best off just being patient and waiting to find some cheap controllers on ebay or possibly from any forums members here who may have extras. It is easy to find pc engine DUO taps going for around $10 on ebay. Also, if you are fine settling for standard white pc engine controllers that don't have rapid switches then you can usually find those for around 12-15 a piece.
You may be very right. That is also kinda why I posted. If I could find all the stuff for cheap, then maybe I skip the project. If, however, there were others that thought it was a great idea, I could be convinced to produce more than just for myself. We'll see how it plays out, but I do appreciate all the input you guys are giving.
Oh, and for the record, I am completely fine with white PCE controllers or even broken ones that I could fix. I view this as extra functionality that will just supplement my primary controller. Most of the time I'd just stick with the single standard TurboDuo controller.
Another thing is that I did find some good info about PCE 6-button functionality and Genesis 6-button. Maybe I should change the scope of this project. Let's toss that in the mix for possible outcome. If there was a way to take a Genesis 6-button controller and plug it into a converter to PCE, would that be of general interest?
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis Controllers
Post by: soop on May 02, 2012, 11:14:17 AM
I really think you would be best off just being patient and waiting to find some cheap controllers on ebay or possibly from any forums members here who may have extras. It is easy to find pc engine DUO taps going for around $10 on ebay. Also, if you are fine settling for standard white pc engine controllers that don't have rapid switches then you can usually find those for around 12-15 a piece.
You may be very right. That is also kinda why I posted. If I could find all the stuff for cheap, then maybe I skip the project. If, however, there were others that thought it was a great idea, I could be convinced to produce more than just for myself. We'll see how it plays out, but I do appreciate all the input you guys are giving.
Oh, and for the record, I am completely fine with white PCE controllers or even broken ones that I could fix. I view this as extra functionality that will just supplement my primary controller. Most of the time I'd just stick with the single standard TurboDuo controller.
Another thing is that I did find some good info about PCE 6-button functionality and Genesis 6-button. Maybe I should change the scope of this project. Let's toss that in the mix for possible outcome. If there was a way to take a Genesis 6-button controller and plug it into a converter to PCE, would that be of general interest?
Now THAT would be cool. although those pads you linked to look pretty crappy, the button profile is huge, which gives an indication to the quality
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis Controllers
Post by: roflmao on May 02, 2012, 01:25:39 PM
If you look up the user Hit-Japan on ebay he often sells PC Engine hardware and software for fairly reasonable prices (though they have crept up a bit over the past year). I Just got a tap from him for $15 shipped. It's sitting on my desk right now since my Duo is out for repair.
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis Controllers
Post by: Flavor on May 03, 2012, 04:39:40 AM
I looked at a bunch of info and thought about this in my sleep last night.
I think I will start with building a "Genesis controller -> PC Engine" adapter. In my mind, this would be a cable that would plug into your PCE and have a Genesis port on the other end. I will try to get this working with the 6-button Genesis controller.
Once that works, I will have to figure out how feasible and useful it is to build this as a single-controller converter or if it would be better to build it into a TurboTap style device like my initial idea.
In the meantime, keep the ideas coming. Tell me what you'd want to see from a project like this. Thanks!
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis Controllers
Post by: soop on May 03, 2012, 04:43:07 AM
I looked at a bunch of info and thought about this in my sleep last night.
I think I will start with building a "Genesis controller -> PC Engine" adapter. In my mind, this would be a cable that would plug into your PCE and have a Genesis port on the other end. I will try to get this working with the 6-button Genesis controller.
Once that works, I will have to figure out how feasible and useful it is to build this as a single-controller converter or if it would be better to build it into a TurboTap style device like my initial idea.
In the meantime, keep the ideas coming. Tell me what you'd want to see from a project like this. Thanks!
Well I guess if you figure out the Genesis one, a Snes one would be neat. I have a couple of Super Advantages that would be nice to use on Street Fighter II.
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis Controllers
Post by: roflmao on May 03, 2012, 09:15:51 AM
In the meantime, keep the ideas coming. Tell me what you'd want to see from a project like this. Thanks!
Wow, a 6 button Genesis controller adapter would be awesome!
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis Controllers
Post by: Duo_R on May 03, 2012, 05:34:26 PM
as far as converting NES for cost it really isn't that high, a 35 cent chip, a cable that costs about 2 bucks and a NES controller. If it is more about converting a Genesis controller that I completely understand.
Try NES controllers, easier to convert and have a more similar button layout. See the link in my signature for instructions. Hopefully u can get a tap on the cheap.
I do agree that NES is much more similar as far as layout goes. However, Genesis is appealing for cost reasons. The way I am thinking about doing it, I would not have to mod the actual Genesis controller at all. The main downside is that the Genesis doesn't have a SELECT button, so maybe the A or C button would be SELECT. Also, the Genesis controller socket is much easier to source.
I see old NES controllers for sale constantly often times at cheap prices, Genesis controllers not nearly as much. Do you mean cost issues with modifying a NES pad, or the actual cost of the controllers themselves?
Yea, I mean that (as far as I can tell) the cost of building an interface to the NES would be higher than what I'd need to build to interface with Genesis. I am still in the early design phase, though, so this sort of input is helpful.
I have seen Genesis controllers sell on eBay for like $2 each, so I think that's cheap. http://www.ebay.com/itm/120879810907
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis Controllers
Post by: Flavor on May 04, 2012, 02:46:20 AM
as far as converting NES for cost it really isn't that high, a 35 cent chip, a cable that costs about 2 bucks and a NES controller. If it is more about converting a Genesis controller that I completely understand.
Well, I don't want to confuse the situation here. I know that people have converted NES gamepads to work on their PCE. However, that's not what I'm talking about. Those mods (at least the ones I've seen) are modifying the actual game controller. This does 2 main things that I want to avoid: 1) The controller becomes unusable on the original system. 2) A non-technical person can not easily make use of the project.
What I am talking about is building a converter. You take your original/unmodified controller, plug it in to the converter cable, and plug the cable into your PCE/TG16. Anyone can do it, and when they're done, they can plug the controller back in to their NES/Genesis/etc.
So, if I wanted to do this converter for NES/SNES, the connector to plug the controller in to is not easy to find/buy. That means if I wanted to make the converter cable for others, it's going to be a problem.
I don't want to limit the project to being only useful to me. Once it works, if other people are interested in such a device, I want to be sure that all the parts are available.
I guess what I'm saying is that I would like to steer away from relying on removing parts from something else.
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis Controllers
Post by: DragonmasterDan on May 04, 2012, 03:35:21 AM
Well, I don't want to confuse the situation here. I know that people have converted NES gamepads to work on their PCE. However, that's not what I'm talking about. Those mods (at least the ones I've seen) are modifying the actual game controller. This does 2 main things that I want to avoid: 1) The controller becomes unusable on the original system. 2) A non-technical person can not easily make use of the project.
What I am talking about is building a converter. You take your original/unmodified controller, plug it in to the converter cable, and plug the cable into your PCE/TG16. Anyone can do it, and when they're done, they can plug the controller back in to their NES/Genesis/etc.
So, if I wanted to do this converter for NES/SNES, the connector to plug the controller in to is not easy to find/buy. That means if I wanted to make the converter cable for others, it's going to be a problem.
I don't want to limit the project to being only useful to me. Once it works, if other people are interested in such a device, I want to be sure that all the parts are available.
I guess what I'm saying is that I would like to steer away from relying on removing parts from something else.
Ahh, I thought the idea was to make a turbo tap out of another systems multitap. Example, taking an NES 4 score and configuring it to go to a TG or PCE. Thus using original unmodified NES controlers on NEC hardware.
(http://i.imgur.com/mUSog.jpg)
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis Controllers
Post by: Duo_R on May 04, 2012, 03:50:44 AM
Got it, you are building a converter similar to this:
I think a SNES layout would be better than Gens overall. Yeah the 6 button might be cool for fighting games but everything else might be weird. And with 6 button you will only have Start / Run bit no select (or vice versa)
Snes will work with the layout better
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis Controllers
Post by: Flavor on May 04, 2012, 04:30:00 AM
Yeah, sorry guys. I guess I was unclear, but in some ways that may have been good. This way, maybe you have projected your wants on to the project. That's good for learning about what is most useful/desired.
Duo_R: I think you could be right about SNES->PCE being a better controller layout. The upside is that if I get my Genesis->PCE converter working, I think the technique could be adapted to other systems. The downside is that the only way I see to get cheap SNES sockets is to buy an extension cable and cut it in half. If the socket itself were readily available, this might be better than Genesis.
DragonmasterDan: Your thought about taking a 4-Score or MultiTap from some other system is something I have thought about. It was not what I had planned, but it is an interesting idea. The more I think about it, though, I just don't know if it's a good way to go. I think it could be doable, and maybe some of the techniques would be similar to the converter cable approach, but it would be much more complex.
For general appeal to a wider audience (than just myself), the more I hear from you guys, and the more I think about it, the more it seems that the TurboTap aspect of the project may be unnecessary.
The one idea that seems to be most appealing to you guys is the prospect of having a 6-button controller converter (whether that be Genesis, SNES, etc.). Would you agree, or am I off base with that?
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis Controllers
Post by: DragonmasterDan on May 04, 2012, 05:52:22 AM
The one idea that seems to be most appealing to you guys is the prospect of having a 6-button controller converter (whether that be Genesis, SNES, etc.). Would you agree, or am I off base with that?
Yeah, there's definitely interest. The lack of a select button on the Genesis six button pad makes it a less desirable option from a usability standpoint than the SNES though.
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis Controllers
Post by: DragonmasterDan on May 04, 2012, 05:55:03 AM
Oh and BTW I saw your signature about the NGPC flash linker. I have an old school bung cart and serial port based linker. Would that linker be able to write to my old bung cart via USB, or would I need a flashmasta cart?
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis Controllers
Post by: Flavor on May 04, 2012, 05:59:11 AM
Oh and BTW I saw your signature about the NGPC flash linker. I have an old school bung cart and serial port based linker. Would that linker be able to write to my old bung cart via USB, or would I need a flashmasta cart?
Well, you would not need the Flashmasta cart, but I have only been selling "bundles" of both. If you're interested in further discussing that, I'd suggest contacting me through that website and I'll get back to you via email.
The one idea that seems to be most appealing to you guys is the prospect of having a 6-button controller converter (whether that be Genesis, SNES, etc.). Would you agree, or am I off base with that?
Yeah, there's definitely interest. The lack of a select button on the Genesis six button pad makes it a less desirable option from a usability standpoint than the SNES though.
Okay, okay. You've convinced me. :D
I still say that it may need to be Genesis for logistic reasons, but SNES would be better.
Okay, so assume for a moment that it can be SNES. What about a box that had 5 SNES ports to plug SNES controllers in to. On the other side, a round PCE (or TG16) cable would stick out to plug into your console. This would bring the discussion full circle back to the TurboTap idea, but with SNES controllers instead. The scope would now include 6-button support AND TurboTap support.
I really like the discussion here. I know I probably sound a bit schizophrenic going back and forth on ideas, but each time I think we're honing in on something more worthwhile.
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis/SNES Controllers
Post by: soop on May 08, 2012, 12:19:09 AM
Agghhh, I agree, but I have NO idea where you're gonna source SNES ports (unless you buy a multitap which probably isn't cheap). It's just because it's a non-standard connector.
But also, if you go the turbo tap route, you could build an extension cable into it to kill 2 birs with one stone. It will probably only add $2 to the cost, but people often want them. I know I wouldn't be without mine.
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis/SNES Controllers
Post by: vestcoat on May 08, 2012, 05:12:44 AM
Agghhh, I agree, but I have NO idea where you're gonna source SNES ports (unless you buy a multitap which probably isn't cheap).
Ask the guy who makes the Retrode. He found a place that makes 'em.
Actually, I did that. :D He had them made special for his project, I think. However, with that lead, I may be able to work something out, myself.
Thanks for the input guys. I did some work on getting a SNES controller to work on the PCE. It's got a long way to go, but I'm pretty convinced that I can get it working.
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis/SNES Controllers
Post by: Flavor on May 11, 2012, 08:16:27 AM
As an update, I can play some games with a SNES controller. I am not doing multiple controllers yet, though.
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis/SNES Controllers
Post by: DragonmasterDan on May 11, 2012, 08:25:57 AM
Nice, I take it it's just a two button converter right now?
Right. I have built in support for 6-buttons (for future expansion), but I need to get 2btn perfected first.
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis/SNES Controllers
Post by: BigusSchmuck on May 11, 2012, 08:53:29 AM
Sounds like its at the same level as the playstation converter. Now if that was modified to play 6 button controller games and turbos that would be sweet. Nevertheless, its still cool you got a snes controller to work..
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis/SNES Controllers
Post by: Flavor on May 11, 2012, 08:58:36 AM
Sounds like its at the same level as the playstation converter. Now if that was modified to play 6 button controller games and turbos that would be sweet. Nevertheless, its still cool you got a snes controller to work..
To me, it won't be finished until it can do all that. For now, having it work at all is a fun feat.
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis/SNES Controllers
Post by: SignOfZeta on May 11, 2012, 09:26:06 AM
I just noticed this thread!
I think the SNES pad is a good way to go. Genesis sounds good at first but six button Genesis pads aren't as easy to find as the three button ones, and a lot of the three button ones have awfully worn out d-pads. SNES pads are significantly more durable, from my experience. Of course, the button config doesn't line up well for Street Fighter II, but...oh well.
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis/SNES Controllers
Post by: Flavor on May 11, 2012, 09:52:37 AM
I think the SNES pad is a good way to go. Genesis sounds good at first but six button Genesis pads aren't as easy to find as the three button ones, and a lot of the three button ones have awfully worn out d-pads. SNES pads are significantly more durable, from my experience. Of course, the button config doesn't line up well for Street Fighter II, but...oh well.
Nice to see you, SignOfZeta. The more I looked at it, Genesis may be fine to do as a single-controller deal. SNES can do the turbotap thing better. Also, it's a better layout, and Genesis lacks the select button.
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis/SNES Controllers
Post by: soop on May 13, 2012, 10:31:34 PM
I have to say, although I don't need one, I kind of want one... I didn't hear the sound on the video, what was that PCB with the orange light?
It was probably my logic analyzer, and the sound wasn't anything worth hearing, I'd say. :)
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis/SNES Controllers
Post by: Necromancer on May 15, 2012, 02:38:14 AM
Man, that's great! I love the MacGyverishness of it all.
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis/SNES Controllers
Post by: soop on June 07, 2012, 04:33:59 AM
Hi Flavor, how's the project going?
i just thought of something I'd like (and I don't know if it exists); a PC Engine to USB converter. It would involve coding a driver, but if emulators have multitap support, that would be killer - take a laptop out and hand around the joypads!!!
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis/SNES Controllers
Post by: Flavor on June 07, 2012, 04:52:18 AM
i just thought of something I'd like (and I don't know if it exists); a PC Engine to USB converter. It would involve coding a driver, but if emulators have multitap support, that would be killer - take a laptop out and hand around the joypads!!!
Good timing. I was thinking of posting an update today. Here's some tech mumbo jumbo that may or may not be interesting.
The vid I posted before was my first attempt, and I built it with a microcontroller doing the work. I was very pleased with the layout of the code and how it would be easily extensible (to more controllers or custom button mappings or whatever). However, the microcontroller proved to be too slow for anything but that single 2-button controller shown in the video.
I've been slowly working on setting up a redesigned version using a CPLD as the main "brains". Last night I was able to get that up and running for the first time. Again, this initial test was just a single controller, but the CPLD way of doing it should mean that adding more controllers/buttons shouldn't slow it down at all.
So, the good news is that the project is finally back on track and working great. I don't have a vid of the new version, but really it would look about the same as the previous video. It's just a different mess of wires this time.
I have seen devices like the one you've described. I know they exist for NES, SNES, PlayStation, etc. I don't know if I've seen a PCE version, though. The nice thing is that coding the driver would be pretty easy since it could just build on the other previous designs. I think there was some open-source stuff. I have no idea if these converters would support multitap, though. My guess would be NO. You would probably use 1 converter per controller.
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis/SNES Controllers
Post by: soop on June 07, 2012, 04:56:42 AM
Nice work! I don't know what a CPLD is though ^___^
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis/SNES Controllers
Post by: Flavor on June 07, 2012, 05:02:04 AM
Nice work! I don't know what a CPLD is though ^___^
It's a Programmable Logic Device. A microcontroller is like a small CPU that can easily do digital IO. Think of an Arduino.
A CPLD (or FPGA or whatever) is more like a bunch of logic gates that you can program. You could build the same logic with a bunch of specific logic chips wired together, but I think the CPLD is easier to manage.
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis/SNES Controllers
Post by: Flavor on June 14, 2012, 02:14:54 PM
Here's a picture of the latest incarnation. It's not so pretty, but it's getting better. (http://www.flashmasta.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/SNES-To-PCE-Turbotap-6-14-12.jpg)
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis/SNES Controllers
Post by: roflmao on June 14, 2012, 02:57:10 PM
Here's a picture of the latest incarnation. It's not so pretty, but it's getting better. (http://www.flashmasta.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/SNES-To-PCE-Turbotap-6-14-12.jpg)
Holy Moly! :shock: That looks awesome!
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis/SNES Controllers
Post by: HercTNT on June 14, 2012, 03:52:29 PM
Nice work!! just don't walk through an airport with it.
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis/SNES Controllers
Post by: Flavor on June 14, 2012, 05:25:38 PM
Any update on this? It would be awesome to be able to convert snes or genesis pads to a pc engine cause new ones are about $4 on ebay.
Sadly, no. I definitely want to get back to this, but other things keep coming up.
That's exactly the reason I wanted to start this project, and the single SNES->PCE works. I just wanted to also build it with support for multiple controllers, and that's where things got trickier.
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis/SNES Controllers
Post by: soop on September 21, 2012, 05:12:01 AM
I would have thought starting with a SNES multitap would have been easier?
Ah well, while I would like to see this finished, at least it was interesting, and it seems like you had fun :)
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis/SNES Controllers
Post by: Flavor on September 21, 2012, 05:57:35 AM
Well, it's still on my list, and I will get back to it. I just don't know if that means weeks or months or what.
I just need to quit my real job, and then I'll have time to finish all of my projects. :)
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis/SNES Controllers
Post by: KnightWarrior on September 22, 2012, 06:54:29 AM
Will the SNES Modded Tap be priced lower then the TurboTap??
When you get done with it
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis/SNES Controllers
Post by: Flavor on September 22, 2012, 08:51:07 AM
I would have to test this, but yeah, I think it could be important to have such a feature.
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis/SNES Controllers
Post by: KnightWarrior on September 30, 2012, 04:50:55 PM
Thanks..
I be buying one for sure..
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis/SNES Controllers
Post by: KnightWarrior on January 21, 2016, 12:51:13 PM
A long Time Bump..
Is he still doing the Multi Tap Idea for the Super NES controllers?
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis/SNES Controllers
Post by: Flavor on January 22, 2016, 09:36:26 AM
This is definitely an old project by now. I'd still like to work on it, but we've been working on Neo Geo Pocket and WonderSwan flash cartridges lately.
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis/SNES Controllers
Post by: KnightWarrior on January 28, 2016, 07:28:03 PM
I would buy one, If it's not to expensive
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis/SNES Controllers
Post by: KnightWarrior on May 08, 2017, 07:46:47 PM
Anyone else try to make a Adapter for SNES Controllers on the TurboGrafx-16/Duo?
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis/SNES Controllers
Post by: Vimtoman on May 08, 2017, 10:57:47 PM
Ive made one and raffled the first proto. search for SNES2PCE.
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis/SNES Controllers
Post by: Flavor on May 09, 2017, 03:48:42 AM
Nice work, Vimtoman! It looks like your raffle was almost a year ago, though. Are you producing these? Did you ever work on a "multitap" feature of it?
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis/SNES Controllers
Post by: Vimtoman on May 09, 2017, 06:18:24 AM
I looked into making a multitap version but meant going the Asic or FPGA route. Not had much experience with them so stopped at the pad conversion. May have another look sometime.
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis/SNES Controllers
Post by: Flavor on May 09, 2017, 06:20:21 AM
I looked into making a multitap version but meant going the Asic or FPGA route. Not had much experience with them so stopped at the pad conversion. May have another look sometime.
Are you still making/selling these SNES2PCE boards?
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis/SNES Controllers
Post by: haightc on May 09, 2017, 11:42:58 AM
I was wonder how the snes pads work over all I have an Avenue 6 and 3 and mouse. Several games act a little quirky when playing with the av6, plus the pad is huge. I would like the have smaller pad but they seem to go for $25+ these days. If you have an adapter adapter I would be interest in that. I didn't find anything with a quick search of SNES2PCE as you suggested however. I did find a link about modding a NES controller so I may give that a go down the road. Both SNES/SFC and NES controllers are in expensive. Modern copies vary in quality but tend to be much better than the cheap genesis ones. In the late 90s I would say the position was reversed.
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis/SNES Controllers
Post by: wilykat on May 09, 2017, 11:03:18 PM
I've wondered how the multitap actually works. I know about the polling but is there a way to integrate multitap inside a console and maybe have a switch to toggle between player 1 only for most games and 5 players mode for party games? 4 pole double throw switch to toggle the 4 controller data lines between multitap chip and bypass for one controller?
Title: Re: "Poor Man's TurboTap" Hardware Project for Genesis/SNES Controllers
Post by: Vimtoman on May 10, 2017, 07:23:02 AM
I will dig out the box and see what I have left.
Flavor & haightc PM me with your details e.g location etc