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Tech and Homebrew => Turbo/PCE Game/Tool Development => Topic started by: spenoza on November 01, 2017, 09:56:20 AM
Title: Apple/early PC games worth porting to PCE
Post by: spenoza on November 01, 2017, 09:56:20 AM
So, after chatting in another thread about my love for the Apple II, it got me thinking about what Apple II or other early PC games would make fun conversions to PCE. I'm thinking more basic action games than RPGs and whatnot, because they would conceivably be easier to handle code-wise, much like the early arcade titles Arkhan and Touko favor. Here's what I've identified as good candidates so far.
Lode Runner: Yes, the PCE already has a version, but it's heavily altered. The original has a 28x13 grid for more complex levels. I think it would be fun to try to adapt that to the PCE with a more modern aesthetic, though dealing with tile compositing might be challenging, since a nonstandard 10x11 tile size would have to be recreated.
Boulderdash: Much easier than Lode Runner. Basic tile-based game with rudimentary "physics". Movement is grid-based. Would be important not to smooth that out too much or the game would be too hard to control.
Choplifter: pretty simple shooty game. Has a lot in common with Defender in some ways.
Any other fun suggestions?
Title: Re: Apple/early PC games worth porting to PCE
Post by: Gredler on November 01, 2017, 10:00:27 AM
A Tank War style game would be awesome to have - especially if it were 5 player!
I played Scorched Earth on my DOS PC like crazy, a while after playing Artillery on my grandpa's Apple II. Both are great, now only Worms has modern releases. I would love to play something like that on PCE :D
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Artillery_game
Title: Re: Apple/early PC games worth porting to PCE
Post by: SignOfZeta on November 01, 2017, 10:01:38 AM
Everything I can think of needs a keyboard or an analog stick.
Title: Re: Apple/early PC games worth porting to PCE
Post by: spenoza on November 01, 2017, 10:10:44 AM
Deathtank Zwei on PC Engine?
Title: Re: Apple/early PC games worth porting to PCE
Post by: Gredler on November 01, 2017, 10:14:33 AM
The art requirements would be so puny I would definitely volunteer to provide you with some tanks and some tilesets.
Not sure how you would tackle the terrain system, that shit baffles me
Title: Re: Apple/early PC games worth porting to PCE
Post by: Arkhan on November 01, 2017, 10:22:37 AM
Horizon V and FALCONS
and Drol.
Title: Re: Apple/early PC games worth porting to PCE
Post by: SignOfZeta on November 01, 2017, 10:28:05 AM
IS it possible to do the terrain deformation that occurs in these games on the PCE? I wouldn't begin to guess how that would be achieved.
I would assume so since they ported Worms to Gameboy. Of course I have no clue how because I couldn’t port 10 PRINT “SIGNOFZETA RULES” 20 GOTO 10 to a Gameboy.
Title: Re: Apple/early PC games worth porting to PCE
Post by: Gredler on November 01, 2017, 02:52:22 PM
IS it possible to do the terrain deformation that occurs in these games on the PCE? I wouldn't begin to guess how that would be achieved.
I would assume so since they ported Worms to Gameboy. Of course I have no clue how because I couldn’t port 10 PRINT “SIGNOFZETA RULES” 20 GOTO 10 to a Gameboy.
Sorry I should have been more specific - I wonder if this is something HuC could do - AFAIK that is predicated on using Tile Maps + Sprites for all visuals. I would imagine this is done with raster fills of some sort? Plot points and fill with a color, then add remove points to change the fill based on radii of the impact point and stats of the attack.
I'd love to hear an experienced non-artist explain the potentials of it being possible.
Title: Re: Apple/early PC games worth porting to PCE
Post by: SignOfZeta on November 01, 2017, 02:54:05 PM
On the Gameboy they built the ground out of sprites. Mainly it’s columns of sprites like Connect 4.
Title: Re: Apple/early PC games worth porting to PCE
Post by: Gredler on November 01, 2017, 02:56:11 PM
On the Gameboy they built the ground out of sprites. Mainly it’s columns of sprites like Connect 4.
Wow that's super impressive, I just looked up a video thanks for suggesting it.. MATH! I assume the sprites change based on the angle and distance to the point of impact to create those nice craters?
Title: Re: Apple/early PC games worth porting to PCE
Post by: SignOfZeta on November 01, 2017, 03:09:52 PM
The more I watch the thing the more I don’t know what’s going on. Now I’m wondering if the graphics are independent of the hit boxes and rendered in different ways.
Alternatively, what’s the highest resolution screen wide Tetris Attack engine you can make? That’s the ground. You couldn’t do cliffs this way but it could be cool.
Title: Re: Apple/early PC games worth porting to PCE
Post by: Keith Courage on November 01, 2017, 04:17:19 PM
I grew up with an apple II and these were some of my favorites.
Apple Diamond Mine https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tg6vQt8rLSQ Aztek https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S6ljdh2wL00 Zaxxon https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hMSXkOUJAEQ Drol https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ThmJb8tALe8 Cannon Ball Blitz https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4pcZPzoMLY Snack Attack https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ivAZkuBbpsM Donkey Kong https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tvbtiaacd9w Speedway Classic https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w3tSKhW22tc Lode runner https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=72k1ZYp83tc County Carnival https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m3rDuUPrM50
Dos Street Rod 2 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hGj_tRSPHhU Stunts https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2e8jBm-CCmA I also 2nd Scorched Earth
No idea why Diamond Mine has never received a console port or conversion of any sort. Such a great game. Drol and Aztek also seem like games that should have had a console port.
Title: Re: Apple/early PC games worth porting to PCE
Post by: Arkhan on November 01, 2017, 04:34:23 PM
street rod sounds like a hobo porn title.
Anyway, Worms is totally possible. We had Lemmings.
It does the same shit.
Title: Re: Apple/early PC games worth porting to PCE
Post by: gilbert on November 01, 2017, 09:12:49 PM
As Karateka was mentioned already, I'll say Prince of Persia.
Yes, there is a SCD port of this game, and it's not a bad one, but I think some aspects of it are a bit off. Some of these are possibly related to the later enhancements, but anyway: 1. It seems that there aren't as many frames as in the original versions, making the movements a bit stiff. 2. I personally don't like the speed setting(I think this was an additional feature originally introduced in the Japanese computer ports). IMO as the characters were originally rotoscoped they should only be played at one single speed to get the correct frame rate and smooth movement. While setting it to fast speed help you play the game in faster pace it just looks hilarious as hell, and even at the "default" (?) setting I still find it a bit off. Maybe this is one factor that causes problem 1 above. 3. The music cues and jingles. Personally I liked the original ones more. Granted that the original version didn't even have BGM played throughout and that the musics in the PCE version aren't bad, I still find the original ones more suited to the settings, even if you have to emulate how they're coming from Apple ]['s speaker (ideally it's even better if they're based on the PC DOS version, out of soundcards). When Mechner designed his games the presentations were very much related to film making, so the sounds of the original versions were carefully designed to make the game as cinematic as possible (same goes to Karateka). 4. The player's turban. It's also an addition originated from the Japanese computer ports I think. IMO the lack of this turban and the plain outfit of the player in the original versions made it more convincing that you're ripped off of your stuff and become a prisoner. I think even Mechner himself loved the changed though, so every subsequent ports had this change. This is not that important though.
Now that the original design documents and the source codes of the Apple ][ version are publicly available I think it is possible to do a PCE conversion to be as faithful as possible, and see how it compares to the SCD commercial release. It would be great if this version includes an option to switch between the original Apple graphics/sound and somewhat enhanced one too.
Title: Re: Apple/early PC games worth porting to PCE
Post by: gilbert on November 01, 2017, 09:46:55 PM
As Choplifter! was also mentioned, I initially agreed but it at least has to be better than the SMS version (which was based on the Arcade version) to make it worthwhile. It would be just too primitive if it's based on the original Apple ][ version. Also, I think the C64 or whatever version of this game was emulated in a pirated PAL ROM? The one with PAL SMB playing too fast under 60 Hz I think. (Or I just remember this wrongly.) Okay. It seems that the VIC-20 version of Choplifter! was emulated in a pirate multicart called 15-in-1 Mega Collection (not the other multicart which contained Famicom games).
Better, Rescue Raiders: Which I myself considered an enhanced spiritual successor/homage/rip-off of Choplifter!. I think this games had a number of keyboard commands for its strategic features though. Don't know whether they could be translated well to PCE's control.
Also, Wings of Fury: This game is awesome. This game on the PCE will be super awesome.
Title: Re: Apple/early PC games worth porting to PCE
Post by: Punch on November 02, 2017, 04:51:17 AM