Author Topic: PC-FX homebrew development.  (Read 8143 times)

Arkhan

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Re: PC-FX homebrew development.
« Reply #75 on: March 25, 2015, 05:25:52 PM »
well that explains a lot.   So you had people who were either not skilled at games, or simply barely experienced in the game at all, trying to recreate the whole thing.   That's a bit mental.

At least with things like the MSX in Japan, you had Konami cranking out home versions of games.   I guess that's what really separates the quality of games from here and there back then.

The Amiga for one, should have been able to produce very tightly put together arcade games.   For some reason, it did not have many.   Many of them looked great but played like balls.   

Even some of the classics, like Shadow of the Beast, are admittedly a bit retarded.   I prefer the PCE version of that game, because simple mechanical errors are fixed.

And, Operation Thunderbolt on Amiga is fine.  It's as good as any other home version of the game, and plays as good as you'd really expect from a version that lacks the cool, gun controller.

We used to play that, Operation Wolf, and Revolution X (lol) without the cool guns, and they were all fun anyway.

[Fri 19:34]<nectarsis> been wanting to try that one for awhile now Ope
[Fri 19:33]<Opethian> l;ol huge dong

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esteban

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PC-FX homebrew development.
« Reply #76 on: March 25, 2015, 11:49:19 PM »
well that explains a lot.   So you had people who were either not skilled at games, or simply barely experienced in the game at all, trying to recreate the whole thing.   That's a bit mental.

At least with things like the MSX in Japan, you had Konami cranking out home versions of games.   I guess that's what really separates the quality of games from here and there back then.



There is a really wonderful short book written by a developer:

http://bizzley.com

It's Behind You Bob Pape R-Type (ZX Spectrum)

It is such a great read...it really captures so many different aspects of the UK computer scene that I was curious about.

The entire account strikes me as genuine and sincere...no sensationalism, no exaggerated drama, no manufactured dilemmas.

Anyway, it corroborates everything elmer said.  :)
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Arkhan

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Re: PC-FX homebrew development.
« Reply #77 on: March 26, 2015, 08:03:27 AM »
Lol, I know some of the music in games was just written for whatever reason without the musician knowing what the game was or what was going on.


So, stuff like LED storm?   Dude was just jamming out and went oh here, I guess you can put this in the game now.   What is it!


I notice a lot of game shops back in the 80s and even early 90s were basically just kind of winging it.

That's what separates stuff like Valis from Commander Keen.   

Whole company of people vs. Dudes Who stole their work computers to work on the weekends.

I'll have to check that book out.   I like hearing about how stupid things were.
[Fri 19:34]<nectarsis> been wanting to try that one for awhile now Ope
[Fri 19:33]<Opethian> l;ol huge dong

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elmer

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Re: PC-FX homebrew development.
« Reply #78 on: March 26, 2015, 09:37:24 AM »
There is a really wonderful short book written by a developer:

http://bizzley.com

It's Behind You Bob Pape R-Type (ZX Spectrum)

Thank you ... I hadn't seen that before. What a fun read!  :)

At least with things like the MSX in Japan, you had Konami cranking out home versions of games.   I guess that's what really separates the quality of games from here and there back then.

The Japanese arcade companies had a huge incentive for producing decent ports in their own home-market ... producing crap versions would have led to a terrible loss of face ... and no Japanese exec would have tolerated that.

For territories outside Japan, where nobody at home would hear about it ... AFAIK, they couldn't care less. They got their licensing fees, and didn't seem to be interested in trying to impose any quality-control.

elmer

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Re: PC-FX homebrew development.
« Reply #79 on: March 26, 2015, 02:14:50 PM »
There is a really wonderful short book written by a developer:

http://bizzley.com

It's Behind You Bob Pape R-Type (ZX Spectrum)

It is such a great read...it really captures so many different aspects of the UK computer scene that I was curious about.

If anyone is interested in the history of those times, then Chris Wilkins' "History of Ocean" tells the tale of one particular company ... but since it's more of a history-through-interviews, it's not as good of a story-read as Bob's book.

http://www.fusionretrobooks.com/The-History-of-Ocean-Software-p/ocean.htm

There used to be a cheap PDF version, but I can't find it anymore.

Arkhan

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Re: PC-FX homebrew development.
« Reply #80 on: March 26, 2015, 03:00:45 PM »
From what I remember reading, that Green Beret debacle was the last time Konami let round eye touch their software for awhile. 
[Fri 19:34]<nectarsis> been wanting to try that one for awhile now Ope
[Fri 19:33]<Opethian> l;ol huge dong

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elmer

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Re: PC-FX homebrew development.
« Reply #81 on: March 26, 2015, 03:22:15 PM »
From what I remember reading, that Green Beret debacle was the last time Konami let round eye touch their software for awhile. 
Hahahaha ... I can totally believe it after that seeing that mess!

The "History of Ocean" mentions that the C64 version Thunderbolt was another disastrous outside-job,  and that they canned the developer and had to rewrite it from scratch internally in 3 1/2 weeks.

In the early days, that kind of screw-up was unfortunately not as uncommon as it should have been.

Arkhan

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Re: PC-FX homebrew development.
« Reply #82 on: March 26, 2015, 03:36:25 PM »
I'd like to meet the crew responsible for Double Dragon on C64.   I waited about 10 minutes for that trainwreck to load. 

Only to go "....." *click*   and walk back over to play Sega.
[Fri 19:34]<nectarsis> been wanting to try that one for awhile now Ope
[Fri 19:33]<Opethian> l;ol huge dong

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elmer

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Re: PC-FX homebrew development.
« Reply #83 on: March 26, 2015, 03:51:12 PM »
I'd like to meet the crew responsible for Double Dragon on C64.   I waited about 10 minutes for that trainwreck to load.
I just looked on wikipedia ... Binary Designs Ltd ... hahahaha ... yep, they didn't have a great reputation.

Arkhan

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Re: PC-FX homebrew development.
« Reply #84 on: March 26, 2015, 04:18:44 PM »
I'd probably be able to take C64/Amiga game libraries more seriously if there weren't so many shitty ports floating around.

I don't know how Sidearms made it out the door on *either* machine.

[Fri 19:34]<nectarsis> been wanting to try that one for awhile now Ope
[Fri 19:33]<Opethian> l;ol huge dong

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elmer

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Re: PC-FX homebrew development.
« Reply #85 on: March 26, 2015, 04:34:10 PM »
I'd probably be able to take C64/Amiga game libraries more seriously if there weren't so many shitty ports floating around.

I don't know how Sidearms made it out the door on *either* machine.

Hahaha ... now you're talking about Probe Software (Fergus McGovern)  ... another errrr ... not-very-good developer ... but somehow they kept on getting work, and then ...

http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2008/jun/24/fergus.mcgovern

OK, I'm calling "uncle" ... you beat me! Mercy, please! Yes, there were a LOT of really bad ports done in those days.  :wink:

Arkhan

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Re: PC-FX homebrew development.
« Reply #86 on: March 26, 2015, 05:53:19 PM »
at least now I know who to punch in the eye, if I ever see the guy
[Fri 19:34]<nectarsis> been wanting to try that one for awhile now Ope
[Fri 19:33]<Opethian> l;ol huge dong

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Orion_

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Re: PC-FX homebrew development.
« Reply #87 on: May 19, 2015, 04:25:40 AM »
I would be interested to port some of my games on PC-FX, the problem is, how many people actually have a PC-FX and are willing to buy new games ?
The PC-FX is quite expensive, and because most of the games are unplayable, and the playable ones are expensive too, I guess not much people possess this console. (that the reasons I hesitate to buy one)
If there is at least 100~150 people interested, I might consider working on this machine.

Can the current liberis library play audio cd ? Movie ?
« Last Edit: May 19, 2015, 04:27:12 AM by Orion_ »

elmer

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Re: PC-FX homebrew development.
« Reply #88 on: May 19, 2015, 08:02:16 AM »
Welcome!

I think that you'd find it a fun machine to program for, with a very developer-friendly architecture.

More interesting than the PlayStation 1, and much less crazy than the Saturn.

I would be interested to port some of my games on PC-FX, the problem is, how many people actually have a PC-FX and are willing to buy new games ?

You'd probably be better off asking that in the main "PC-FX Discussion" section, because not all PC-FX players/collectors are interested in the "Development" section.

I suspect that a lot of PC-FX owners would be open to new games ... the problem is that even here, there really aren't that many active PC-FX owners.

Quote
The PC-FX is quite expensive, and because most of the games are unplayable, and the playable ones are expensive too, I guess not much people possess this console. (that the reasons I hesitate to buy one)

If you get a used one without-box from sellers in Japan, I don't personally think that the PC-FX itself is that expensive, and surface shipping isn't that bad (but slow).

If you want a boxed one in perfect condition, and you want it fast, then it'll cost one heck of a lot more!

It's cute to have a PC-FX GA, but it isn't actually needed for development unless you want to write code for the 3D chip ... and so limit yourself to the dozen or less people on the planet with a working PC-FX GA setup.

You can develop quite happily in Mednafen while waiting for real hardware to arrive ... Ryphecha's emulation accuracy is excellent, and it's a nicer development environment than the PC-FX GA anyway.

And since the machine has absolutely no copy-protection, you can burn a CD and run anything that you like and try it before deciding whether you want to buy it.

Quote
If there is at least 100~150 people interested, I might consider working on this machine.

That's your decision to make.

If you're interested in being an early developer of Western PC-FX homebrew, and you're not afraid of the challenge of working on a machine that is still fairly unknown, and you're willing to try to puzzle your way through Japanese hardware manuals, then you're in the right place at the right time.

If you're looking for major recognition and some financial reward for your efforts ... then this might not be the best machine for you.

Quote
Can the current liberis library play audio cd ? Movie ?

No, I'm afraid not.

You can see Alex's liberis documentation, and his English copy of the documentation that the Japanese homebrew guys put together in 2000/2001 at http://daifukkat.su/pcfx/

If you really want to develop on the PC-FX right now, Hudson's old PC-FX GA libraries are supposed to work with the old Japanese GCC 2.95 toolchain.

I believe that they were supposed to be limited to only run on the PC-FX GA, but that's probably just in the C startup code, which you could replace.

I'm specifically avoiding the use of those old libraries moving forward, because I want to have a 100% legal toolchain that can be used for homebrew.

AFAIK, that would make it the only 5th-gen machine with a completely legal toolchain ... but I could easily be wrong on that, and would be happy to be corrected.
« Last Edit: May 19, 2015, 08:03:48 AM by elmer »

Necromancer

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Re: PC-FX homebrew development.
« Reply #89 on: May 19, 2015, 08:47:50 AM »
The PC-FX is quite expensive....

I recently sold my extra boxed system and a half dozen common games for $200 shipped, so it's not that expensive.
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