Console RGB vs Wii RGB

[crazydean]

I recently received an official Wii RGB cable from ebay and hooked it up to play some Super Mario Sunshine. It looks fantastic, but it got me wondering how the emulators look vs the real deal.

After a little research, I fired up SNES9X GX on the Wii which is able to output RGB via 240p and took some pictures. I then ran the same game on my modded mini SNES and took some more pictures. Even way zoomed in, I can barely tell which is which. Very surprised.

The sizing isn't the same on the ones I took tonight. So, if anyone is interested in A/B shots, I can take some tomorrow. Also, I was thinking of doing comparisons of other consoles, any suggestions for which? I could do PCE if the emulator allows RGB.

[SignOfZeta]

Wii RGB is incredible. It looks better than consoles.

[DragonmasterDan]

I recently received an official Wii RGB cable from ebay and hooked it up to play some Super Mario Sunshine. It looks fantastic, but it got me wondering how the emulators look vs the real deal.

After a little research, I fired up SNES9X GX on the Wii which is able to output RGB via 240p and took some pictures. I then ran the same game on my modded mini SNES and took some more pictures. Even way zoomed in, I can barely tell which is which. Very surprised.

The sizing isn't the same on the ones I took tonight. So, if anyone is interested in A/B shots, I can take some tomorrow. Also, I was thinking of doing comparisons of other consoles, any suggestions for which? I could do PCE if the emulator allows RGB.

I'm assuming this is on a PAL Wii?

[crazydean]

I'm assuming this is on a PAL Wii?

Your assumption would be incorrect! It turns out that the reason NTSC Wii's can't output RGB is a software block. Here is what I have gotten to output RGB so far:
SNES9X GX for SNES
FCE Ultra GX for NES
USB Loader GX for Wii
Nintendont through USB Loader GX for Gamecube

I haven't been able to get anything else to output RGB yet, but I may just not be finding the proper menus.

PS: Apparently, you can change your Wii's region to PAL to run RGB without using emulator's menus, but it's possible to brick your console during the process.

[Joe Redifer]

Wii RGB is fine for emulators you load onto the system after softmodding it, but not for Virtual Console stuff (blurriness built into the emulators) and not for actual Wii games (can't get 480p). For SNES games I'm not surprised that it would look better than an actual SNES, since the SNES kinda sucks at RGB. It improved a little with later releases of the system but even there it's still a little blurry.

[SignOfZeta]

I should specify that I was actually talking about YPbPr, not RGB. This cable was like $15 new for the OEM, will look identical to RGB.

[Joe Redifer]

Some people say Gamecube component is better than Gamecube games played on the Wii vs component. I need to test this some day. Maybe people are just trying to justify their expensive cables?

[crazydean]

Wii RGB is fine for emulators you load onto the system after softmodding it, but not for Virtual Console stuff (blurriness built into the emulators) and not for actual Wii games (can't get 480p). For SNES games I'm not surprised that it would look better than an actual SNES, since the SNES kinda sucks at RGB. It improved a little with later releases of the system but even there it's still a little blurry.

My BVM monitor won't display beyond 480i, so there's no reason for me to use component cables anyway. As for SNES games, I'm on an RGB modded mini which looks nearly identical to the Wii RGB output. However, the mini looks much better than a standard SNES, anyway. One of the advantages of using RGB for me, is that I already own a SCART switch which allows me to add it right no there.

I don't have any component cables for the Wii, but maybe I'll buy some and do some A/B testing with the RGB.

[Johnpv]

Some people say Gamecube component is better than Gamecube games played on the Wii vs component. I need to test this some day. Maybe people are just trying to justify their expensive cables?

It's true, but the difference isn't huge.  http://retrorgb.com/gamecubevswii.html

[GohanX]

Some people say Gamecube component is better than Gamecube games played on the Wii vs component. I need to test this some day. Maybe people are just trying to justify their expensive cables?

I've had Gamecube component cables in the past, and I can confirm that the Cube component is quite a bit sharper than the Wii. The Wii still looks pretty good IMO, and although I'd rather play  Gamecube games on a Gamecube I'm not about to pony up the current going price for the Cube cables.

Also, SNES games do look better on Wii VC through component than RGB on a real SNES IMO. The image is much sharper than even a modded SNES Jr. I wouldn't blame anyone who preferred playing it on the Wii compared to a real SNES. Personally, I don't care that the SNES is a little blurry, it still looks better than the RF I grew up on.

[mickcris]

The gcvideo ezpaks should be our soon.  Not sure how this will effect the official cable price, but component will have a cheaper option.  I have an HDMI ezpak on order.
http://www.badassconsoles.com/gcvideo-1/

[Joe Redifer]

SNES games do look better on Wii VC through component than RGB on a real SNES IMO

Disagree. Virtual Console games put a low or high pass filter that doesn't need to be there resulting in a blurrier (and often darker) image than a real SNES. An emulator running on a hacked Wii, however, will yield a much better image.

It's true, but the difference isn't huge.  http://retrorgb.com/gamecubevswii.html

I will do a direct-capture test sometime. The results will be much more trustworthy than pictures taken from a screen.

[SignOfZeta]

I disagree with that. Everything recorded with a capture device has the "look" of that capture device in the exact same way it would have the look of any display you run it through. It would be far more scientific to use a capture device since there is more control in the experiment (and no camera or lighting issues to worry about) but I'm not sure what it can actually prove.

I mean...so it's darker. So I turn up the gain on my TV. Is that actually a problem? Gamma is the sort of thing that turns up as "a problem" when you are using a capture device and leaving the settings the same between two SNES/emu but in the real world you just calibrate your display. Minus %2 gamma is irrelevant if you can just dial it up.

[Black Tiger]

The difference between the no-filter hacked and regular N64 games is hard to believe. It is noticeable in every pixel on my crt, even after transcoded from RGB to component.

When I watch the video streaming on my PC as it's being captured (upscaled with a framemeister), the difference is still noticeable, but the filter-hack footage isn't anywhere near as sharp. When I watch the video after it's captured by my elgato HD60(?), you can still make out differences between the hacked and regular games, but the filter-removed footage has already lost all of the detail that transforms N64 games from unplayable to actually nuce looking.

Mixing footage in the video editor I use reduces the clarity further, but the point is that you cannot appreciate the video quality of fixed N64 games with an RGB mod unless you're watching it in person.

[SignOfZeta]

I agree. All of this goes double for when you are capturing composite. There are so many ways to unpack a composite signal and many of the flaws are actively reduced by your capture device, compression codecs, etc, some are increased.

I have a pretty nice Laserdisc setup these days and while I've done a few capture tests and stuff to demonstrate it (LD is very very poorly understood by and large, trying to put some quality videos online) nothing compares to sitting in front of my TV.