Author Topic: REPAIR GUIDE - TurboDuo/PC Engine Duo: Total capacitor replacement chart  (Read 15672 times)

kato

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Re: REPAIR GUIDE - TurboDuo/PC Engine Duo: Total capacitor replacement chart
« Reply #150 on: January 07, 2013, 01:24:42 AM »
Somebody linked this shop in this thread.
Now I am little confused. Should I use 4.7µF with 16V or with 50V?

And I can't find anywhere (within Europe) Panasonic caps with 22µF/16V with a lifetime of 5000h-10000h, only 22µF/25V with 1000h-5000h lifetime or 22µF/50V with a lifetime of 5000h-10000h.
I want them to last as long as possible. Any recommendations?

NightWolve

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Re: REPAIR GUIDE - TurboDuo/PC Engine Duo: Total capacitor replacement chart
« Reply #151 on: January 07, 2013, 03:09:37 PM »
Somebody linked this shop in this thread.
Now I am little confused. Should I use 4.7µF with 16V or with 50V?


That has exactly what you need in one package, one price, but nobody could vouch for the quality. You'll likely need to buy at least two cap kits to get all the values elsewhere.

A small 4.7µF capacitor is likely gonna have a high breakdown voltage of 50V, but anyhow, 16V would still be safe. The Turbo Duo operates at 5V max past the voltage regulator where 10V comes in from the unregulated power supply (so it's probably like ~12.5V)... So, since the motherboard operates at 5V, 16V max caps are perfectly safe and way above that.

When you start getting lower than 10µF to 5µF to 1µF and below (1000pF) as far as capacitance goes, you start getting into the ranges that ceramic capacitors support and they can handle 50V to 250V, while still being small, etc. So, that's why, even though it's aluminum, it can handle 50V max... At 22µF and above, something like that, the the breakdown voltage that the cap can handle goes down, but for more money and at the expense of a bigger size, you can still get them with higher rated breakdown voltages, etc.

Quote
And I can't find anywhere (within Europe) Panasonic caps with 22µF/16V with a lifetime of 5000h-10000h, only 22µF/25V with 1000h-5000h lifetime or 22µF/50V with a lifetime of 5000h-10000h.
I want them to last as long as possible. Any recommendations?


The higher the max breakdown voltage is, the more expensive and bigger the capacitor will be.  As long as it says 22µF, you can use it just fine! So get the expensive 22µF/50V ones if you wanna spend the money and want a high lifetime rating.

Basically, the rule for replacing is: make sure the capacitance value matches exactly, and that the voltage rating is at least twice what the circuit operates at. And simply know that the higher the max breakdown voltage is, the more expensive and bigger that the capacitor will be, as I said, but that it'll still work fine and likely just last longer...
« Last Edit: February 04, 2013, 08:52:39 AM by NightWolve »

kato

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Re: REPAIR GUIDE - TurboDuo/PC Engine Duo: Total capacitor replacement chart
« Reply #152 on: January 09, 2013, 04:34:01 AM »
Ok, thanks!

Does it matter whether I use caps with a maximum temperature capacity of 85°C or 105°C?
It's hard to find all needed caps made by Panasonic. It's easier for me to get caps made by Yageo. Are these any good or are these just cheap Chinese caps?

BlueBMW

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Re: REPAIR GUIDE - TurboDuo/PC Engine Duo: Total capacitor replacement chart
« Reply #153 on: January 09, 2013, 04:47:59 AM »
If youd like, ill put together a cap kit for you.  Shoot me a pm if youre interested.  All Panasonics.
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thesteve

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Re: REPAIR GUIDE - TurboDuo/PC Engine Duo: Total capacitor replacement chart
« Reply #154 on: January 10, 2013, 05:42:48 AM »
Basically, the rule for replacing is: make sure the capacitance value matches exactly, and that the voltage rating is at least twice what the circuit operates at. And simply know that the higher the max breakdown voltage is, the more expensive and bigger that the capacitor will be, as I said, but that it'll still work fine and likely just last longer...
[/quote]

just wanted to add
the life rating of the cap is when operated at its specified voltage/ripple
operating a cap below its ratings will extend its life greatly.

drakewolfe

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Re: REPAIR GUIDE - TurboDuo/PC Engine Duo: Total capacitor replacement chart
« Reply #155 on: January 21, 2013, 08:46:14 PM »
I found this website http://www.anthrofox.org/projects/turbo_caps.html that seems to go into detail about the cap replacement.

NightWolve

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Re: REPAIR GUIDE - TurboDuo/PC Engine Duo: Total capacitor replacement chart
« Reply #156 on: January 23, 2013, 05:25:22 PM »
Figured I'd add this in. This youtuber bought a kit from console5 and got his Turbo Duo working with it.


http://console5.com/store/kits/game-console-cap-kits/game-console-cap-kits-nec/nec-turboduo-cap-kit.html (more $$$ than the HK link though)

The thing about these exact kits is that they're not cost-effective but if you think you'll only ever do something like this once, then they work. For 10 bucks from these Chinese sellers, you can find kits that have 200 pieces total, 20 of each, etc., and after doing a full cap replacement, you'll have plenty of caps left to spare for other possible projects. But you'll likely need to get at least two of these kits in order to get all of the needed values and amounts in the Turbo Duo's case. Anyhow, I'd still say stick to eBay hunting for cap kits there.

BlueBMW

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Re: REPAIR GUIDE - TurboDuo/PC Engine Duo: Total capacitor replacement chart
« Reply #157 on: February 26, 2013, 02:09:52 PM »
jailbar filter caps (someone asked)





I can say this works quite good!  Keith Courage always shows jailbars on the solid blue backgrounds.  Here's a duo RX after installing some caps like steve showed.



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Keith Courage

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Re: REPAIR GUIDE - TurboDuo/PC Engine Duo: Total capacitor replacement chart
« Reply #158 on: February 26, 2013, 02:30:03 PM »
Huh, I've never come across a system that displayed jailbars before. Does it happen with just the stadard composite out or does it happen more when using S-Video or Component?

BlueBMW

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Re: REPAIR GUIDE - TurboDuo/PC Engine Duo: Total capacitor replacement chart
« Reply #159 on: February 27, 2013, 12:04:20 AM »
Mostly on RGB modded systems.
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NightWolve

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Re: REPAIR GUIDE - TurboDuo/PC Engine Duo: Total capacitor replacement chart
« Reply #160 on: February 27, 2013, 02:52:33 AM »
Huh, I've never come across a system that displayed jailbars before. Does it happen with just the stadard composite out or does it happen more when using S-Video or Component?

No, like Blue said, it's a problem that occurs with a RGB connection from what I have heard.

gtsamour

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Re: REPAIR GUIDE - TurboDuo/PC Engine Duo: Total capacitor replacement chart
« Reply #161 on: March 31, 2013, 06:26:24 PM »
No, the jailbar problem is everywhere (RGB, composite etc) and on all PCEngines, you just need to be observative. Its most obvious on solid light colour backgrounds, specificly during horizontal movement and more on LCD tvs than CRTs.
Its more obvious on RGB because RGB gives the best, crispier picture possible but I've noticed the jailbars on all my TG consoles even on composite. Composite is just blurrier so it makes the jailbars less obvious.
From the PCEs I own (and I own many), by far the most intense jailbars are on the Core II.

Does the two tantalum caps shown in the picture above completely solves the jailbar issue or does it make it "lighter"?

I tried another jailbar fix sometime ago that involved tantalum caps (dont remember from whom it was) but not on the legs of the chip. Did nothing for me...
« Last Edit: March 31, 2013, 06:43:59 PM by gtsamour »

thesteve

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Re: REPAIR GUIDE - TurboDuo/PC Engine Duo: Total capacitor replacement chart
« Reply #162 on: March 31, 2013, 07:00:20 PM »
the effectiveness of the caps depends on how close to the chip you can get then and the ESR of the caps.
also RGB mods will often have secondary jailbars caused by the amp/chip/cable/tv grounds not tied at the same point (look up ground loop)

gtsamour

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Re: REPAIR GUIDE - TurboDuo/PC Engine Duo: Total capacitor replacement chart
« Reply #163 on: March 31, 2013, 07:18:58 PM »
Yes its understandable, lets say they are as close to the chip as they can get, like directly soldered on the chip's legs as shown in the picture. Are the jailbars noticeable or completely gone?

Are these caps shown in the picture ceramic or electrolytic? Are they tantalum? I thought tantalum were electrolytic...
« Last Edit: March 31, 2013, 07:37:59 PM by gtsamour »

NightWolve

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Re: REPAIR GUIDE - Simple Jailbar Fix
« Reply #164 on: April 01, 2013, 12:04:58 AM »
To help out, I had made this for the Component thread from steve's photo:



They're polarized tantalums. Fortunately, they're both easy to do. Pin 41 is at the corner of the chip, so you have less of a chance to bridge the pin next to it as opposed to if you had to solder to a pin that has a pin to the left and right of it. As for pin 43, at least in the case where it's on the bottom of a US Duo, you can scrape off the film from the trace or better yet at the via further away from the pin, solder there AND your ground is right there also, so less risky overall, etc.

I tried another jailbar fix sometime ago that involved tantalum caps (dont remember from whom it was) but not on the legs of the chip. Did nothing for me...


You didn't have steve on the case then. ;) As to how well this works, the last comment from someone that tried it was "vastly improved." I'd say that's another satisfied customer!
« Last Edit: April 01, 2013, 12:17:43 AM by NightWolve »