Author Topic: pier solar hd  (Read 3436 times)

Arkhan

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Re: pier solar hd
« Reply #90 on: August 06, 2013, 01:37:03 PM »
Quote from: arkhan
The complaint is that it's a futile effort to prevent dumping.  It always happens.

I don't think it's futile to try and prevent dumping. However it IS futile to say that your game can't be dumped. That's just gonna make people want to dump it more. I don't know if this is something they actually said. I know they said they had taken steps to make it more difficult but I don't remember any direct quotes. If I were them I wouldn't have said anything.

You can't prevent dumping.  The only way to prevent dumping is to just dump it yourself and get it over with.   Enough loyal fans will buy the thing.   Look how many "REAL HARDWARE OR GTFO" people there are on the internet.   

[Fri 19:34]<nectarsis> been wanting to try that one for awhile now Ope
[Fri 19:33]<Opethian> l;ol huge dong

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Black Tiger

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Re: pier solar hd
« Reply #91 on: August 06, 2013, 01:47:07 PM »
Quote from: arkhan
The complaint is that it's a futile effort to prevent dumping.  It always happens.

I don't think it's futile to try and prevent dumping. However it IS futile to say that your game can't be dumped. That's just gonna make people want to dump it more. I don't know if this is something they actually said. I know they said they had taken steps to make it more difficult but I don't remember any direct quotes. If I were them I wouldn't have said anything.

I remember a couple members of Watermelon responding to claims (by at least that guy from China a few times) that the game had been dumped and they said that there was no way it had been done and said something to the effect of it will be a long time (if ever) before any one can pull it off successfully. Of the many different ways it was put out there, that someone would be lucky to ever dump it completely and get it to work on anything, it really did seem to be a challenge taken up by pirates.

I don't have a problem with variations of homebrew such as special editions or distinguishable differences for new print runs (even though Watermelon presents itself as more of a business than homebrew, but their first game seems to reflect that level of quality). But I haven't purchased a hard copy of Pier Solar yet because the combination of it being pre-order only without any kind of shipping date window and it coming with "REPRINT EDITION" across the front simply make to lower priority for me than too many other 16-bit games, newer and older. I don't care how good the game may or not be, it's worth buying just to have another game with Genesis aesthetics. I really appreciate that it is 100% original and new, unlike stuff like Oh Mummy! and Super Fighter Team releases.

I'm one of the people who would be happy to pay for an appropriately priced rom version, even if it only runs an emulator it comes with, as long as the emulator is extremely accurate. But I'd rather play the game on real hardware first.

I'm disappointed by the whole PS kickstarter thing, because I'd rather that effort be put into making more <16-bit games and the only ports I'd be excited about would be to <16-bt consoles. Unless the Magical Factory and kickstarter funding is to hire new teams for all of these projects, then the end result is nothing coming out for many years or that money just sits in one place as a single game is worked on at a time.
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TheOldMan

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Re: pier solar hd
« Reply #92 on: August 06, 2013, 03:34:07 PM »
Please note: My original comments were not about whether the game sucked or not. It's a homebrew game, so of course it's not going to be as well done as a professionally made game. That does not excuse their attempts to market it as being 'professionally produced'.

I'm with Arkhan on this. My whole problem is not the game - it's the non-professional way the Watermelon team does things. If they want to be thought of as professional, they should act like professionals. Their mis-statements and abrupt reversals reflect badly on -all- homebrew developers.

In the eyes of Joe Public (who paid his hard earned cash for a new game): If Piers Solar is sub-par, and it's the best the homebrew scene can do (Hey, they're "pros", they even say so), then any homebrew game that gets produced must suck. Never mind that there are a lot of really good homebrew games. This is the one that is being hyped. If you are going to do that, you have an obligation (to the other homebrew devs, and the people who helped you get where you are) to produce a quality game. No broken extras, no 'little' bugs, etc.

If they didn't make enough money to cover their costs, I have no problem with a re-release to help. The problem comes in when you say the second edition is the only re-print, and it's to help cover the costs. And then you do a 3rd edition. And a 4th. All while saying "This is the last one".

Again, we see this same kind of behavior in their kickstarter. Think about it for just a minute: You contribute, and you get to decide what kind of game they write. As my mother used to say, you can't please everyone - so someone isn't going to get the game they wanted. In fact, the little investors are going to get screwed over when someone with more money than brains ( Like EBay resellers) comes in with a wad of cash just so he can have bragging rights and be able to say "That's my game". And it's unavoidable. Another unkeepable promise.

As for porting Piers Solar to other systems? Even 20 years ago, there were cpu to cpu translators. The bulk of the game should be easy to move. Well, assuming they wrote it in any kind of modular fashion. Will that happen? Of course not - they will re-write the game from scratch (probably taking another 8 years). Wasting time when they could be doing something with the things they (should have) learned. And whining because they underestimated the costs - again.

In short, my problem is with people who want to be 'professionals', but don't act like it. They act like children who have to be the center of attention all the time. If they want to be professionals, fine. Let them act like it. Produce a high-quality game.
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FWIW: We could do Insanity on the dreamcast. It's mostly in a c-like language, so it wouldn't be that hard. And Yes, I have done Dreamcast programming before - If Arkhan ever finds me a broad-band adapter, I may do more (buring and re-burning cd's got to be too expensive)
We could do Insanity on the ps1 or ps2. I've done dev work there, too. But there's the problem of making it a bootable disc there. No one wants to jump through those hoops just to play a homebrew game.

The real question, though, is why would I want to? There are other things I would rather be doing besides re-doing yet another version of the same old game. I guess that's where my real problem with them is. I just can't / don't understand why they want to keep doing the same thing, poorly.

Arkhan

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Re: pier solar hd
« Reply #93 on: August 06, 2013, 07:24:25 PM »
I don't understand the Project N/Y stuff that they do.   Just come out with the game theme already.

[Fri 19:34]<nectarsis> been wanting to try that one for awhile now Ope
[Fri 19:33]<Opethian> l;ol huge dong

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Joe Redifer

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Re: pier solar hd
« Reply #94 on: August 06, 2013, 07:51:13 PM »
I think the whole GEMS system is ridiculous. I am not the first to say this (probably someone here did) but people aren't usually in a position to know what they want. They think they know but they really don't. If Nintendo allowed fans to decide the important decisions that went into making Super Metroid it wouldn't be the classic we know today. It would most likely be an overstuffed turkey of a mess.

Quoted for truth. Some people spent so much money voting on things to get into the game, by the time it's all said and done they'll have spent 10x the amount of a normal game. I don't recall the Gems to $ ratio, but you need to pay to vote. You can vote as many times as you want as long as you pay.

PS - You guys are going to LOVE the way Pier Solar HD looks. Love it. High-res backgrounds... same ol' Genesis sprites. Anything that's a sprite will look the same as it did before. But now the blockiness stands out. I don't think a lot of people realize this, they just think they're work in progress screens. Nope, those screens are done.
« Last Edit: August 06, 2013, 07:56:42 PM by Joe Redifer »

Necromancer

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Re: pier solar hd
« Reply #95 on: August 07, 2013, 02:47:28 AM »
I mean what happens if I give them 30,000$ and say "make a game about boners and prison rape."

Best game EVER!
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Arkhan

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Re: pier solar hd
« Reply #96 on: August 07, 2013, 04:23:47 AM »
I mean what happens if I give them 30,000$ and say "make a game about boners and prison rape."

Best game EVER!

The tagline can be "they're going in dry".

I think the whole GEMS system is ridiculous. I am not the first to say this (probably someone here did) but people aren't usually in a position to know what they want. They think they know but they really don't. If Nintendo allowed fans to decide the important decisions that went into making Super Metroid it wouldn't be the classic we know today. It would most likely be an overstuffed turkey of a mess.

Quoted for truth. Some people spent so much money voting on things to get into the game, by the time it's all said and done they'll have spent 10x the amount of a normal game. I don't recall the Gems to $ ratio, but you need to pay to vote. You can vote as many times as you want as long as you pay.

PS - You guys are going to LOVE the way Pier Solar HD looks. Love it. High-res backgrounds... same ol' Genesis sprites. Anything that's a sprite will look the same as it did before. But now the blockiness stands out. I don't think a lot of people realize this, they just think they're work in progress screens. Nope, those screens are done.

does the HD stand for huge disaster?
[Fri 19:34]<nectarsis> been wanting to try that one for awhile now Ope
[Fri 19:33]<Opethian> l;ol huge dong

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esteban

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Re: pier solar hd
« Reply #97 on: August 07, 2013, 07:27:12 AM »
PS - You guys are going to LOVE the way Pier Solar HD looks. Love it. High-res backgrounds... same ol' Genesis sprites. Anything that's a sprite will look the same as it did before. But now the blockiness stands out. I don't think a lot of people realize this, they just think they're work in progress screens. Nope, those screens are done.

This wouldn't be so bad if it was an intentional, aesthetic vision from the game's inception...but it ISN'T. At this point, low-res sprites are simply a cost-cutting, half-assed attempt.

I don't care enough to find the screenshots, though...
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Arkhan

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Re: pier solar hd
« Reply #98 on: August 07, 2013, 07:37:51 AM »


lol.


I mean the only thing I see that is a useful improvement is like:

http://www.gamefaqs.com/xbox360/689129-pier-solar-hd/images/gs_screen-5


The cutscenes portraits look nice. 

If they're not fixing the broken gameplay though, there's not much point to playing an HD version.
[Fri 19:34]<nectarsis> been wanting to try that one for awhile now Ope
[Fri 19:33]<Opethian> l;ol huge dong

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esteban

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Re: pier solar hd
« Reply #99 on: August 07, 2013, 07:45:37 AM »
^Thanks for linking to the images. 

The cutscenes looked nice before, but this is a definite improvement. However, the sprites....

My prediction: in a year, there will be a new HD SPRITES PIER SOLAR Kickstarter campaign.

Stages...do this in stages and milk every part of the process.

Then, HD DOLBY SURROUND SOUND Kickstarter in 2015...
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Black Tiger

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Re: pier solar hd
« Reply #100 on: August 07, 2013, 08:52:31 AM »




It looks like parts of backgrounds which used sprites before are being left with the low res graphics and are being blurred in places. Even if they have specifically stated that this is how the final HD version will be, I really don't believe that they will ship it without updating the sprites first.
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Arkhan

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Re: pier solar hd
« Reply #101 on: August 07, 2013, 09:21:17 AM »
They probably will, and they'll come up with some goofy term for the style.



 High Retronition graphics!
[Fri 19:34]<nectarsis> been wanting to try that one for awhile now Ope
[Fri 19:33]<Opethian> l;ol huge dong

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ProfessorProfessorson

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Re: pier solar hd
« Reply #102 on: August 07, 2013, 11:07:23 AM »

Original:

Kickstarter suped up edition:

nodtveidt

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Re: pier solar hd
« Reply #103 on: August 07, 2013, 01:36:38 PM »
I wouldn't say Pier Solar "blows". It's a lot more professionally done than Mysterious Song which seems very amateur in comparison. I got bored with that one and stopped playing a few hours in. I'm certainly not saying Pier Solar is the greatest thing ever designed. It has lots of little design flaws in there. It's just not as bad as some of the people who program their own games here would have you believe. Those are the ones who piss and moan about Pier Solar the most. Put your money where your mouths are. Design something that blows it away. So far I've only seen simple arcade-like games and an old, very basic RPG which isn't special at all.
It's good to know that I can take all of this with a grain of salt and know that you're talking out of your ass just to get a reaction. :lol: Everyone knows that if you haven't cleared Mysterious Song within a few hours, you suck at life and should just kill yourself. :P Furthermore, I wasn't judging Pier Solar personally, just collecting all of the opinions thus far into a conclusive list and drawing a conclusion based on that.

Gillian Seed

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Re: pier solar hd
« Reply #104 on: August 07, 2013, 02:12:17 PM »
I agree with Joe actually. That combination of HD backgrounds and 16-bit sprites looks really nice, but I do feel like the backgrounds could look much better. Those trees in particular are bothering me.

Also did they ever say anything about fixing the balance of exp? or did they play the "someone beat the game without leveling up once" card again.